The EFTM podcast – Scammers are targeting us at our most vulnerable time and AI is helping them

[00:00:04] Voice Over: The EFTM Podcast. Talkback Technology. Got a question about tech? Trev’s here to help. Not sure what to buy? Ask Trev. Australia’s number one talkback technology podcast.

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[00:00:59] Trevor Long: Great to have your company on another episode of the EFTM Podcast. Um, we are live in London this week and we’re here with Samsung as a guest of Samsung for their Unpacked event later this week. Uh, off the top of my head, Thursday morning your time, a couple of days away. Um, and I’m kind of interested here because, like, we’ve been talking foldables for so long with Samsung, 6, 7 years. Uh, but it feels like the year of the foldable, right? Because of Apple. Like, that’s the, it’s the unwritten weirdness of this week is where we’re talking about it because of their competitor. Like, I’m not— let’s be real, I’ll be inside baseball with you here. If, if Samsung, if Apple hadn’t, uh, you know, leaked their form factor, which we know to be kind of passport size open-up fold, um, would Samsung have, uh, created this rumored wide version of theirs? And if they didn’t, would this week be a very big struggle exposure-wise? Because I, I’ve said to, um, people at Samsung sometimes, you know, we’ve got to make sure that you understand that it’s not a guarantee that an announcement is news. A new version of a product isn’t always going to be news, especially now that we’ve reached peak smartphone, um, and we’re almost at the point of peak foldable. Um, so yeah, I’m like, I don’t know what the Fold 8 is going to be, but let’s just ignore the wide. But let’s say the Fold 8 is the same width and form factor and all that kind of stuff, and it’s just got some extra AI or extra camera power. Same with the Flip. Like, is it enough to really push and buy into it being a big deal? That’s what I struggle with. And I say that about iPhone 18. So if Apple does not— so the weird thing is if Apple does not release a Fold this year, then the story is they didn’t release a Fold. But if there was no rumor of Apple releasing a Fold this year as strong as it was, and they just came out with the iPhone 18 Pro and Pro Max, well, the story would probably be, why didn’t they release the 18? But like, they’re incremental these days. So we are really at a point where the software is driving things, and that’s why iOS 27, um, is, is a story. But that was in DubDub. So it’s a, it’s a fascinating thing to me, um, the, the need for innovation, the need for change to drive the story that is there’s something new and cool. But anyway, we’ll find out later this week. I think the odds are very strong that we’re looking at a Flip 8, a Fold 8, and a Fold 8 or Fold Wide 8, 8 Fold Wide. I don’t know what it’s going to be called. It’d be wild, wild if they call it the Fold 8 Ultra, given the rumors that iPhone Ultra is their name. Wouldn’t it be wild if Samsung went, we’re calling it the Samsung Galaxy Z Fold 8 Ultra? That’d be hilarious. I would laugh. I would laugh a lot because there’s no way Apple could call it the iPhone Ultra. I don’t think they can call the iPhone Fold either, so they’ve got fun and games on their hands anyway. A couple of calls today about Wi-Fi and, um, and, and phones, but we’re also going to talk security, internet security, and keeping yourself safe online. Scammers, hackers, AI— it’s a, it’s an ever-prevalent issue. We’re going to talk to Lynette Owens, who’s from TrendLife, formerly Trend Micro, about some of the research they’ve, they’ve done and what they’ve found, um, just about scams and our susceptibility to scams at certain ages and styles and you name it. All that to come on the EFTM Podcast.

[00:05:11] Voice Over: Tech, cars, lifestyle— this is the EFTM Podcast with Trevor Long. You can text Trev now, thanks to Vodafone, on 0477 657 657.

Ian — Samsung phone ownership and mystery bloatware apps

[00:05:24] Trevor Long: Great to have your company and love to hear from you anytime. You can just get in touch as Deeksy says. Ian’s on the line. G’day, Ian.

[00:05:31] Ian: How are ya?

[00:05:32] Trevor Long: Mate, really well. What can I do for you?

[00:05:35] Ian: I sent you a message a while ago about the fact that even though we pay a fortune for our phones, uh, Samsung still own them.

[00:05:46] Trevor Long: Okay, explain.

[00:05:48] Ian: Well, I— this is quite a few years ago now— I had an issue with one of the updates that they sent out, and it changed a hell of a lot of things on my phone. And I mean, virtually everything. Yeah, I had to ring their, uh, help people. They were very good. And I said to the guy I was talking to, why the hell is this going on? And he said, well, we own the phones. And when you think about it, first of all, my phone is locked in with Optus to start with. Yeah. Secondly, there is what we call bloatware, a hell of a lot of things that are actually put on by Samsung and they can’t be got rid of.

[00:06:29] Deeksy: Yeah.

[00:06:30] Ian: And it’s the same with Google. There’s a lot of stuff that they put on that you can’t get rid of.

[00:06:34] Trevor Long: I disagree on that. I think if you bought a Pixel phone, you’d be blown away by how much less software is pre-installed on that. It’s a very vanilla version of Android.

[00:06:43] Ian: Well, it’s the same thing. You still got a million things on— like, I’ve got heaps of stuff on my phone that I never use.

[00:06:51] Deeksy: Hmm.

[00:06:52] Ian: And this is the stupidity of it. If we’re supposed to be paying, you know, like $1,000 for a phone, why don’t we own it?

[00:07:00] Trevor Long: Well, first and foremost, you absolutely own the phone. They can’t take the phone from you. They physically don’t own the phone. There’s nothing ownership-wise that Samsung has over you, but the software that you are choosing to buy into by buying a Samsung phone, in the same way that Apple, uh, don’t own anyone’s iPhone, but every year they release a brand new version of iOS, um, that they don’t own your phone, they’re just releasing updates to their software, new features, new capabilities, also most importantly security updates. Now you don’t have to upgrade your phone. You absolutely are not required to, and you can turn off all auto updates on your phone. But if you do that, you are firstly at risk of the phone not working at some point because there may be updates that keep it properly connected to the telco networks who may change their settings. Secondly, it may— you may miss out on security updates, which may make you quite vulnerable to hackers and other viruses. And thirdly, you’ll miss out on any new features, which it sounds like you don’t care about, which is totally fine. But the thing is, they don’t own your phone. Let’s be very clear, they don’t own your phone.

[00:08:12] Ian: Well, I’m 74. My very first computer was a Commodore 64.

[00:08:17] Trevor Long: What a cracker! I love that device. I talk about it so much. I’ve still got one. You know, you could buy a Commodore 64 again from the Commodore 64 company.

[00:08:26] Ian: I heard that, yes.

[00:08:28] Trevor Long: And you know what, they’re releasing a phone you should buy, the Commodore 64 Flip Phone. It’s a simple flip phone that does have a couple of apps. It has WhatsApp and I think Maps on it. Um, but you know, maybe that’s the perfect phone for you if you don’t need all the bloatware.

[00:08:45] Ian: No, listen, I’m still sitting on my S10. I’m quite happy with that. I don’t need all the fancy stuff like my kids do.

[00:08:53] Trevor Long: Trust me, the Commodore 64 Flip Phone is not fancy.

[00:08:58] Ian: Yeah, no, I’m quite happy with what I’ve got. As I said, it’s just the fact that there is so much stuff in there that you just can’t get rid of unless— name something you can’t get rid of. Oh, hang on, I have to go through the list. That’s getting technical now. Um, now you’re putting me on the spot, aren’t you?

[00:09:20] Trevor Long: But is it an app, like, or is it something that happens on the phone?

[00:09:24] Ian: No, they’re actual Samsung apps.

[00:09:29] Deeksy: Yep.

[00:09:30] Ian: And some of them you can actually shut down, but you can’t delete them.

[00:09:36] Trevor Long: Right.

[00:09:37] Ian: And this is where I reckon it’s wrong. You should not have to be able to put up with all that sort of rubbish.

[00:09:46] Trevor Long: Look, I think that what some super nerdy people would say to you is there are ways of deleting it. You need to do what’s called— and this sounds—

[00:09:54] Ian: unlocking it.

[00:09:55] Trevor Long: Well, it’s even worse. It sounds very crude, but trust me, it’s a real thing. You need to root the phone. Which basically takes away all of the bloatware. But mate, in the end, I just think the complexity of doing that is far beyond anything that you truly need to worry about. But that said, it’s frustrating to you. The thing is, you’ve got an S10. That’s had a great life. And if it’s still working for you, I’d be loving the fact that Samsung own the phone, in your words, because it’s lasted you that long.

[00:10:30] Ian: Oh, look, I don’t have a problem with the company and the quality of their goods. I just did not like the fact that some turkey turned around and said to me, look, we still own the phone. What the hell?

[00:10:40] Trevor Long: Yeah, well, let’s be clear, that bloke’s a turkey because that is 100%— we need to be clear, he was being flippant, I’m assuming, because there’s just absolutely no ownership at all involved, in Samsung going forward.

[00:10:56] Ian: Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[00:10:59] Trevor Long: Well, mate, enjoy the S10, because it’s a great phone.

[00:11:05] Ian: Yes.

[00:11:06] Ian: Um, here we go. AOD Notify. An AOD?

[00:11:11] Trevor Long: Is it an app? Yep. I mean, I’ve never heard of it, and I think you absolutely should be able to delete that.

[00:11:19] Ian: Well, it says Force Stop. That’s it.

[00:11:22] Trevor Long: If you push and hold the app, you can’t delete it.

[00:11:25] Ian: No, there are other ones. As I said, that’s just the first one that I saw.

[00:11:30] Trevor Long: I actually don’t think that’s a standard, um, Samsung installed app. I think that’s come to your phone another way.

[00:11:37] Ian: Oh, look, the thing is that they actually install a lot of these apps as well, mate.

[00:11:42] Trevor Long: Who’s that?

[00:11:42] Ian: I don’t update anything.

[00:11:45] Trevor Long: Trust me, Samsung didn’t install that app. That is not an app that Samsung uses. It’s a Notification Light app. I’d stand by that statement. I don’t think for a second that Samsung installed that app. I actually think there’s something else on your phone which is installing these apps. I think you may have— not a virus but a malware app that is installing these things.

[00:12:26] Ian: So hang on here, there’s a feature on your Galaxy phone lets you view the time, date, notifications, missed calls, and other stuff when your screen is off.

[00:12:34] Trevor Long: Yeah, is that what it says about AOD? Yeah, yeah, see, that’s a—

[00:12:38] Ian: that’s on the Samsung site. No, no, I don’t need that.

[00:12:42] Trevor Long: Mate, I honestly— the best thing you could do for your phone today is back up your photos and contacts, and I would do a factory reset of that phone. I would do a factory reset and find out what is truly built into that phone. But I bet you any money there’s a bunch of other bloatware apps that are on there for other reasons, not Samsung’s.

[00:13:07] Ian: I actually use several apps to check my phone on a continuous basis.

[00:13:18] Ian: For anything and everything.

[00:13:19] Trevor Long: Are they Norton, Trend Micro, or McAfee?

[00:13:23] Ian: I don’t use Norton for the simple reason that it has a massive footprint and whatever they do. McAfee, I don’t have a problem with. I use Geeky Security, AVG Virus, Anti-spy and, um, what the hell’s the other one?

[00:13:40] Trevor Long: There’s a huge chance one of your anti-spy apps is actually a spy app.

[00:13:47] Ian: No, I check them out way beforehand, mate. Part of my hobby is some computer security.

[00:13:52] Trevor Long: That’s awesome. But what you’re missing is the fact that somehow on your phone is an app called AOD Notifier, which Samsung didn’t put on your phone. So if you want my advice, which you asked me for, um, I would format that phone. I would do a factory reset on that phone today, and I would cautiously install any apps you need and then see what apps are actually on it from the start. I bet you any money AOD Notify is not one of them.

[00:14:17] Ian: Yeah, that wouldn’t surprise me. As I said, there is actually— I have actually had apps installed with an update from Samsung. And that’s a fact.

[00:14:29] Trevor Long: I’m not doubting that, Ian, but what I’m doubting is you’ve given me one example and it is not such an app. Absolutely not.

[00:14:39] Ian: Well, it’s registered on their website.

[00:14:41] Trevor Long: Yes, mate, anyone can install an app on their website. Anyone can provide apps to the Samsung Store just like they can in the Apple Store. But what I’m saying is how it got on your phone is not because of Samsung. So you’re blaming Samsung for all these updates and owning your phone, but I actually think it’s something you did to the phone. I think it’s an app you installed on the phone. That’d be my guess.

[00:15:02] Ian: Yeah.

[00:15:06] Trevor Long: Anyway, if you want my advice, format the phone and see for the next week what’s actually on your phone. You might be blown away.

[00:15:15] Ian: All right, no problems. I’ll have a think about that.

[00:15:18] Trevor Long: Good luck, buddy. No worries at all.

[00:15:20] Ian: All right, thank you very, very much for that. You have a good day.

[00:15:22] Trevor Long: You too, mate. Have a good one.

[00:15:23] Deeksy: Cheers.

[00:15:23] Ian: Take care.

[00:15:24] Trevor Long: See ya. I mean, I don’t know about you, but that— yeah, and look, I might be wrong. Someone please correct me if you’ve got AOD Notifier on your phone from Samsung that they installed, yada yada yada, because I’ve never heard of it, and I’ve used plenty of Samsung phones. If they were installing that by default, I reckon I would have seen that app. It’s a notification app. They would build that into the operating system. But it’s an S10, so maybe there’s another reason. But to have multiple security apps monitoring your phone, and it’s like people saying, I’ve got a cleanup app on my Mac, it’s going to be malware. I can tell you right now, it’s going to be malware. Um, I don’t know, I try, I try.

[00:16:11] Voice Over: Helping Australians with tech questions for over 15 years, the EFTM podcast with Trevor Long.

[00:16:22] Trevor Long: And always love to help you with your tech questions. If you’ve got a question about technology in your life, you’re looking to buy something new, or perhaps you’ve bought something new and you’re struggling with it, happy to help wherever we can. You can get in touch, send me an Ask Trevor request through the EFTM app. You can go to eftm.com, or you can send me a text message or a WhatsApp to 0477 657 657. Now, a topic we’re going to be talking about today, well familiar with me talking about here, is cybersecurity and keeping ourselves safe in a digital world. And it’s something we could talk about every week. And it’s something that never ceases to amaze me in terms of the ways, the means, and the efforts that scammers will go to. And it’s interesting to me that you could almost call this a scammers’ Christmas time, you know, end of financial year, the finances, we’re thinking about tax time. There’s a lot of moments in life that scammers are there to take advantage of, and then they’re savvy, they’re smart, they’re one step ahead of us as well. Plus, you’ll be fascinated to see just who are taking the biggest digital risks. So to talk about that and more, from TrendLife, formerly Trend Micro, Lynette Owens, Vice President of Consumer Education and Marketing, joins me. G’day, Lynette.

Lynette Owens (TrendLife) — Scammers targeting Australians at vulnerable moments, and how AI is fuelling scams

[00:17:36] Lynette Owens: G’day, Trevor. How are you?

[00:17:37] Trevor Long: Great. Thank you for joining me, because this is— I’m sure it’s a topic that given your job, you talk about a lot, but even in social circumstances, I’m often surprised how some people are just unaware of these things. Maybe they never thought it could happen to them. I had an aunt tell me she was scammed out of $7,000 recently, and I was just blown away by that. And the circumstances are ones that maybe I could have helped to foreshadow or foresee. But let’s talk about the time of year stuff. You know, tax time, it is the perfect time for a scammer because we all want to get our tax return. We want to be on time with the government. That’s, I guess, the reason the scammers are thinking, let’s start targeting these Aussies with scam ideas.

[00:18:24] Lynette Owens: You’re right. Actually, there are a number of moments, big moments in our lives that we’ve started to notice scammers targeting people all over the world, including in Australia. And tax time is no different from one of those. But there were some other moments that in a recent study that we did of 10,000 consumers around the world, 1,000 of them being from Australia. And, you know, we’ve also seen this pattern that people impersonating businesses or the government tends to be at the top because we are more prone to pay attention when they’re impersonating.

[00:19:09] Trevor Long: We’re trusting. We’re trusting.

[00:19:11] Lynette Owens: Yes, yes, we are. So unfortunately, the scammers, they’re not just taking chances. They are full-on, very well-run businesses.

[00:19:21] Trevor Long: That’s a good point.

[00:19:22] Lynette Owens: So they understand their target markets very well, and they’re going to take advantage of those times when we might be a little bit more vulnerable, might have our defenses down a little bit. And tax season, other moments are when we’re buying, making very big investments or purchases.

[00:19:43] Trevor Long: And one of those is like a property purchase, for example. You talk about the number of people who see this happen. 1 in 5 Australians have been scammed or know someone close to them who was scammed while making a major purchase like a car or property. And I guess that goes to that trust in— it might be the message comes from a conveyancer or a real estate agent or a car company or a car dealership. You know, a scammer doesn’t need to know much about what you’re about to purchase to become part of that process. And that’s what they do. They insert themselves, don’t they, in that purchase?

[00:20:18] Lynette Owens: That’s correct. But it’s not just the fact that they’re once again trying to impersonate a business because they’re well aware that you’re in the middle of this transaction. It’s also that they’re catching us at a moment when our anxiety might be a little bit higher. We also don’t make big purchases like that very frequently. So we’re probably going to be engaging with a party we’ve never met before. So we don’t know necessarily that that’s not in fact who they say they are. So, yes, unfortunately, that was the top of the list. Big investments, big purchases at the top of the list of the moments when people have been scammed. I think the other that’s surprising, but we’re in a moment in time where a lot of people are shifting jobs. Maybe you’re fine in your job, but you’re investigating another one. Maybe you’ve lost your job and you’re looking for a new one. But that actually was number 2 on our list.

[00:21:17] Lynette Owens: 18% of people. Yes.

[00:21:19] Trevor Long: And so again, if you’re out of work and you think you’re on the hook for a new job, you’re excited. If you get an email that says, just send us this paperwork, which might be your identity, it could be anything as simple as that, couldn’t it? That begins the process of a scam business. And that’s a really good point you make. These are not, you know, kids in a basement. These are businesses that are out there targeting people essentially professionally in their most vulnerable times.

[00:21:49] Lynette Owens: In some cases, this is correct. And actually, in addition to them being very well-run businesses, there’s another power at play here, and that is AI.

[00:22:03] Lynette Owens: AI has made these cybercriminal enterprises a lot more effective, a lot more efficient, a lot more personalized and targeted in their work. So all they need to know is perhaps in a data breach of some kind, perhaps with a bank, they realize there are people applying for loans and mortgages and things like that. They know your name and they know that you probably are looking for a house. So now that’s all they need to know. They can target you with messages saying, there’s a piece of information missing. You’re not going to get the house if you don’t reply by a certain period of time.

[00:22:46] Trevor Long: Again, playing on that real sensitivity.

[00:22:49] Lynette Owens: Yes, AI has made it easier because in writing that message, the telltale signs have disappeared. There’s no more misspellings or incorrect grammar.

[00:23:00] Trevor Long: It feels like just years ago we were saying that’s one of the great things. You can look for poor English, poor grammar. But yet here we are now, we’ve empowered ourselves with this unbelievable thing where I can write an email or an article and say, can you properly spell check this and give me any suggestions? But so can the scammers, and that’s what they’re doing. It’s part of their workflow.

[00:23:20] Lynette Owens: It is 100% part of the workflow. And it’s not just using AI to target you and to remove those barriers to the telltale signs anymore. They’re also, in the name of workflow, starting to automate a lot of these processes.

[00:23:40] Trevor Long: Right.

[00:23:40] Lynette Owens: Building AI agents. What we used to see at TrendLife was somewhere in the world, a new kind of scam was taking hold. And then over time, we noticed they were testing it there, and then they’d move to another country because somehow they figured out the secret to success. We are no longer seeing that. The time has contracted. They’re able to now target multiple places in the world at once because they don’t need to test as long— they can execute many of them at once, get the feedback right away and improve their process and move on. All of the reasons that we want to use AI ourselves, but in their case, it’s for a criminal enterprise.

[00:24:24] Trevor Long: And essentially they’re probably having a better hit rate too. Isn’t it weird for us to be talking about scammers as frankly, as real people because they’re disgusting. But, you know, in a business, you look at outreach, you’re trying to get new leads or clients, and you have a success rate on a campaign and that kind of thing. They would be doing the same. They would be going, well, since we’ve implemented this process of AI, we’re getting now a 20% hit rate on this email or this outreach. And they would be improving their business using these tools.

[00:24:57] Lynette Owens: That is correct. And you know what’s interesting— another thing about AI that came across in this research was we actually asked people, when you’re in these big life events, you’re planning the new purchase, maybe you’re planning a wedding, maybe you’re sending a kid off to college or university or whatever the big life moment was, do you actually use AI to help you? And 38% said they did. Which was a lot higher number than I would have thought because in order for AI to help you through those moments, you’re probably giving it a lot of information about your life, about what it is that you’re going through. And one of the biggest concerns we have when you tie this back to cybercrime is the risk that we actually take ourselves. That downstream could end up in the hands of a cybercriminal, right? So we are in the middle of another study right now and can’t wait to share all of that with you. But one of the things we’re starting to see in the early results, we simply ask people, are you sharing personal information to AI?

[00:26:14] Trevor Long: Yeah.

[00:26:15] Lynette Owens: Not whether it’s through big life moments or any other moments. And a lot of people are saying they do. And I think it’s very surprising, stunning to me that what we seem to not do with social media— everybody knows now to be much more careful about what you’re sharing on social media. We’re not applying the same behavior.

[00:26:36] Trevor Long: Isn’t that funny? We’ve actually had success in getting people to stop oversharing because we essentially educated them. And I say we because it’s companies like you at TrendLife and me through my outlets that we’ve tried to slowly educate people on little things like school uniforms in photos and things like that. And not posting when you’re on holidays, post when you’re back, all these little things. But then what we’re not thinking about is which AI am I using and how much information am I handing over to it and where’s that information going? And while there may be some trustworthy systems and places you can work with, there’s plenty of people who are using free simple tools that may be add-ons and just front ends to another system that is then scraping your information. And goodness knows what we’re handing over in it. And if we’re doing it without any thought because we think it’s so cool, that’s probably where we start to really bring ourselves undone.

[00:27:32] Deeksy: I do.

[00:27:33] Lynette Owens: And I worry about people of all ages not realizing a couple of things. Number one, just because the AI chatbot responds to you as if it’s a real person— it’s very interesting having used multiple, and I’m sure you have too, they all have their personalities, right? And so I can see how it’s very enticing to continue the quote unquote conversation about whatever’s troubling you at the moment or whatever it is that you’re trying to work through. But that’s one of the issues we worry about— people really should think this is still just a tool. You’re still giving it data. The data is moving somewhere, being collected somewhere, being stored somewhere. And they don’t realize that, in some cases, you can opt out of your prompts being used to train the model, right? Because people don’t realize that’s a setting. But the second thing is, any of them— and I won’t name them, but you probably know who they are— any of them that really need to make money by selling advertising on them, they’re going to make it either not possible for you to opt out or make it difficult for you to find how to opt out.

[00:28:48] Trevor Long: That’s the business model, isn’t it?

[00:28:50] Lynette Owens: Oh, absolutely right. It’s exactly the same path that we’re going down right now that we did 5 to 10 years ago with social media.

[00:28:59] Trevor Long: Let’s talk about demographics quickly. Yeah, I want to talk about young people, but I first want to talk about older generations. There’s a simple stat here that says Australians over 65 are the least likely to check carefully website URLs. Now, I can tell you my mum lives 5 hours away and I drove to see her on the weekend and she was questioning about her phone. So I went, okay, this is simple. Handed over and I installed TrendLife Mobile on there. ‘Cause I’ve got multi-device access. So I was able to just add her to my account basically. And the first thing I did was enable the SafeWeb as well as app checking and things like that. Because you know what? I can’t be with her. And she rings me and says, “I got this text message.” I can’t see it because I’m not there. She doesn’t know how to screenshot and send it to me. So it’s a really simple thing to say, it’s a level of peace of mind that you can bring to yourself if you’re over 65 or your parents, if they’re over 65, to just know that even if they do get some sort of weird email, text message, whatever, that web protection can exist on a smartphone. I think still so many people don’t realize your smartphone can be protected by internet security software.

[00:30:04] Lynette Owens: It absolutely can. But I will even offer you something more powerful than that. Not too long ago, we released a feature called Family Circle. And this exists in our scam check tool. So basically, if you have scam check and your mother has scam check, there is a way in which if she is starting to be targeted and continues to engage with somebody who’s actually not— doesn’t have her best interest in mind, you will be alerted.

[00:30:37] Deeksy: Oh, wow.

[00:30:38] Trevor Long: That’s amazing. Yeah.

[00:30:40] Lynette Owens: And I think it’s something— the reason we felt it was very important is because of exactly what you’re describing. So many of us adult children who worry about people younger and older in our lives, we can’t be everywhere all the time. And we notice that technology in general doesn’t design around families. They design around individuals.

[00:31:04] Trevor Long: And we’re the tech support. So—

[00:31:07] Lynette Owens: Yeah, exactly. That’s exactly right.

[00:31:09] Trevor Long: I’d like to be kept in the loop when my mom’s messaging some random new person and they’ve started asking for personal details and make you click links. But then the education part then leads into the younger end of the spectrum where we’re talking about young Australians, 18 to 24, not really checking whether there’s legitimacy in organizations. We’re talking about super young people using AI. So there’s so much to be done to educate the next generation as well.

[00:31:41] Lynette Owens: There is. And I think what we always say at TrendLife is that no matter what the technology is, and in this day and age with AI, there will be no way— it is becoming harder with just the naked eye or your hubris or your confidence. It’s not going to be enough for you to recognize when you actually are being targeted. And the criminals know that. So the combination of education and good tech tools is the best approach to staying safe online. With regard to the younger Australians, we see this across all ages. Everyone thinks, oh, I can recognize the scam, there’s no way that they’ll get past me, right? But the problem, as I said before, it’s becoming harder. It’s more targeted, more personalized. So even in our data, I think very few younger Australians are even using any kind of protection at all.

[00:32:43] Trevor Long: I was just going to read that stat out. 1 in 4 don’t use internet security or antivirus software on their PC. 59% do not use protection on their personal mobile device. I think it is the great unknown out there, or the great uneducated. We need people to know that it’s their mobile where you actually almost more vulnerable because it’s so personal and you are more likely to be flippant with a message that comes through as opposed to an email on your computer. So that 59% of Australians more broadly aren’t using protection on their mobile device is staggering to me.

[00:33:22] Lynette Owens: That is correct. And I think if anything, if anyone takes anything away from this, it’s please go and do that. It’s very possible you’re already paying for it, because you’re protecting your laptop or your desktop, you probably bought a subscription that covers multiple devices. So just take care of it for sure. But I think the other thing too is that with mobile devices, we are doing more of our life on it. We’re buying things, we’re using Apple Pay, we’re browsing and then we’re purchasing, we’re communicating. If anything, it’s the one thing you should protect the most— using it more of the days, hours of your day.

[00:34:07] Trevor Long: I think there’s a lot of takeouts from this. I think one, scammers are smart and professional, and we need to be just on a higher alert than ever. AI is as powerful for a scammer as it is for us. Protection is still key, and protecting your mobile device is a big part of that. And we’re all going to go away— I’m going to go away quite intently and do some research into the Family Circle because that is going to give me just another level of peace of mind. So we’ll investigate that and play around with that over the weeks and months ahead. That’s a great insight for me, let alone everyone else listening. Lynette, lovely to talk to you. Thank you for the efforts you’re undertaking and the research you’re doing. It’s funny because it’s not just about having the software that helps us, it’s about doing the research that helps us understand why.

[00:34:57] Lynette Owens: That is correct, and thank you so much for having me.

[00:35:00] Voice Over: This is the EFTM Podcast.

Vic — NBN upgrade speed problems and patchy Wi-Fi coverage

[00:35:06] Trevor Long: Trevvy Company, I’d love to hear from you. 0477 657 657, text or WhatsApp, whatever works for you. Vic’s on the line.

[00:35:13] Vic: G’day, Trev.

[00:35:16] Trevor Long: Mate, really good. What can I do for you?

[00:35:18] Vic: Trev, I’ve been having a bit of trouble with my internet since we transferred across to NBN.

[00:35:23] Trevor Long: Right.

[00:35:24] Vic: The speed seems to have gone down. They relocated it to the front of the house where we used to have it in the middle in the office.

[00:35:30] Trevor Long: When did you transfer to the NBN?

[00:35:32] Vic: In May.

[00:35:36] Trevor Long: What were you using before that?

[00:35:42] Vic: ADSL.

[00:35:43] Trevor Long: Where do you live?

[00:35:45] Vic: In Brisbane.

[00:35:46] Trevor Long: You’ve been on ADSL until now?

[00:35:50] Vic: Yeah.

[00:35:51] Trevor Long: Really?

[00:35:53] Vic: There’s not been a problem.

[00:35:55] Trevor Long: I mean, I feel like they cancelled ADSL 10 years ago. Are you sure you weren’t on NBN just using fibre to the node, like using an old phone line, and you’ve now upgraded to a different sort of NBN fibre?

[00:36:11] Vic: We were upgraded— I can’t remember what we were on before. It just used to work. And since they transferred it to the NBN, I’ve been having issues. And just recently I complained a few times.

[00:36:23] Trevor Long: Which telco are you with?

[00:36:26] Vic: Telstra.

[00:36:30] Trevor Long: Interesting. Okay. Are you paying more now that you’re on the NBN?

[00:36:34] Vic: I’ve actually just upgraded yesterday to the 500 Mbps. But I’ve got a better upload, but my download is no different.

[00:36:51] Trevor Long: How are you testing that? On what device and what app?

[00:36:54] Vic: It’s on the Telstra app on my iPad.

[00:36:57] Trevor Long: And okay, so the NBN box is now at the front of the house.

[00:37:02] Vic: Yes.

[00:37:03] Trevor Long: Is that correct? So here’s what I think, and I feel like I’m going to need to check, but I think that you’ve had the NBN for probably 10 years through Telstra, but you had what we call fibre to the node, which is essentially NBN via the old phone line. So you haven’t had to have any work done in your house. It was using— you were plugged in where the phones used to plug in. And I think what they’ve done is— you didn’t ask for the higher speeds, did you?

[00:37:32] Vic: That, um, at that stage, no. No.

[00:37:35] Trevor Long: So some people get upgraded because they ask for higher speeds, but I reckon maybe they’ve decided that your area has just got really slow internet and they’ve decided to upgrade the whole area, let’s assume. And so they’ve done the fibre install, so you’ve now got fibre all the way to the home, or maybe to the curb, but bottom line, you’ve been upgraded to a different NBN technology, which is why the NBN box is now down the front of the house. Now, is the NBN box— is there an NBN box and a Telstra box?

[00:38:02] Vic: Oh, that’s the question. I’ll come out tomorrow.

[00:38:07] Trevor Long: Is it like in the garage or—

[00:38:09] Vic: No, no, it’s in our formal lounge room.

[00:38:12] Trevor Long: Right. Okay.

[00:38:13] Vic: Okay. We’ve got a two-story home and I found that where we used to have the modem for the internet was in the office.

[00:38:22] Trevor Long: Yes.

[00:38:23] Vic: And it was more central. But I find that my Wi-Fi has not been as good. And you know, when you’re trying to download something, it just scrolls and scrolls.

[00:38:34] Trevor Long: Right, right, right.

[00:38:36] Vic: Let’s have a quick—

[00:38:37] Trevor Long: let’s have a look behind that couch.

[00:38:40] Vic: Well, it’s almost there. Just at the moment. What have we got now? We’ve still got the Generation 2. I think there’s another little thing in the wall.

[00:38:52] Trevor Long: So there is a Telstra box there.

[00:38:54] Vic: Yeah.

[00:38:54] Trevor Long: There?

[00:38:55] Vic: Hang on just a moment. See if it says Telstra or something else.

[00:38:59] Trevor Long: What color is it? Black or white?

[00:39:04] Vic: Now my Telstra one is white.

[00:39:06] Vic: Okay, that’s the Gen 2.

[00:39:08] Trevor Long: Yep.

[00:39:08] Vic: But then there’s another box behind it, on the wall. So it’s got NBN.

[00:39:16] Trevor Long: Excellent. And it’s white.

[00:39:17] Vic: White.

[00:39:17] Trevor Long: So the thing— here’s the first thing you need to do. Ignore the Telstra app, and I want you to, on your phone/iPad, whatever you choose, download— don’t do it now, I’m talking about your instructions for going forward— download the speed test app. Okay, speed test. And when you search for apps, there’ll be lots of them called speed test, but the one you want is made by a company called Ookla. It’ll stand out, you’ll remember it. Ookla, O-O-K-L-A, Ookla. So speed test by Ookla is like the global standard for speed test apps. Now what I want you to do is do a speed test sitting there next to that modem, next to that Telstra box, and establish what speed you’re getting. Because essentially that’s going to tell you how fast the internet actually is coming into your home, because Wi-Fi is pretty good up close. And then you go to the next room and you do a speed test. And when you do a speed test, do a couple back to back, establish yourself a bit of an average. And I think as you move further and further away from that modem, the speeds will get worse. And that is exactly what’s causing the problem for you. Telstra do have the ability to buy what we call mesh add-ons to their modems. I’m not sure it works with their Gen 2, and frankly, I don’t think you should be paying Telstra to upgrade. They’ve essentially forced this upgrade upon you. So I’d be pushing pretty hard to say, hang on a minute, I didn’t do anything and you’ve just changed everything on me— can I get what I need to make this work now, which is you need mesh Wi-Fi. So they’re little boxes that just plug into a power point somewhere else in the house, but they can’t be too far away from that modem. But what they do is they extend the network. But critically, I don’t want you to get a Wi-Fi extender— that’s a different product. I want you to have a mesh system. Now, if Telstra won’t help you with that then your only option is to throw the Telstra box away and go to JB’s or Harvey’s and buy yourself your own mesh Wi-Fi system. Because a mesh system— so I’ve got a two-story house like you, and I’ve got three boxes in my home. One of them, like yours, is plugged into the NBN box right there at the front of the house. Another one is in the middle of the lounge room, just on a bookshelf, plugged into a power point. The other one is upstairs in a cupboard in the hallway where I have a power point and together they connect to each other and they create really good Wi-Fi throughout the whole home.

[00:41:54] Vic: Right.

[00:41:54] Trevor Long: And that’s what I’ve just done.

[00:41:55] Vic: I’ve just done the download for you now.

[00:41:58] Vic: I’ve got the iPad here and the ping rate is 26.81 and the other one is 46.12.

[00:42:08] Trevor Long: The download speed. Yeah, download speed is horrible.

[00:42:14] Vic: Yes.

[00:42:16] Trevor Long: And so the thing here is that’s Telstra. That is Telstra, full stop. Now the problem is when you go to another side of the house, trust me, that number will get worse because that modem is not rigged to provide Wi-Fi to a large area. It’s a good modem, but you know, it’s like I’m getting a ping of 14 and a download speed of 920, and I’m paying for 1,000. So you should be seeing a 400+ sitting next to the modem on Wi-Fi, not plugged in with a cable. You should be seeing 400 to 450 easily. And then if you get a mesh system, you should get that same number everywhere. Now, do you know what you’re paying Telstra?

[00:43:03] Vic: Well, I was paying, I think, 93, then went down to 89, and now I’m paying $99 because I’ve got a home phone.

[00:43:13] Trevor Long: Yep.

[00:43:14] Vic: I’m a pensioner, old bloke, you know. So I like having the old, the landline. So there aren’t too many plans you can get with that on there, I don’t think.

[00:43:27] Trevor Long: But you’re right, there’s not a lot, but there are some. I want you to do this before the end of the day. I want you to ring Aussie Broadband.

[00:43:35] Vic: Yeah.

[00:43:35] Trevor Long: Okay, they’re an Aussie company. They’ve got a 1300 number on their website. They have Australians in their call center, and they’re really lovely people. And I want you to say to them, what’s the best plan you can do for me for 500 speed with a landline? And find out what they say, because, okay, you know, I know their prices, uh, at $99 a month. They may charge an extra $10 for the landline, maybe, I don’t know. But I would balance them against Telstra price-wise. And then I would say to you, once you ring Telstra and say, this is horrible, what are you doing? So don’t— when you talk to Telstra, don’t talk about the speed around your home, okay? Firstly, just focus on— there’s two problems you have, and you should address them separately.

[00:44:28] Vic: Separately.

[00:44:29] Trevor Long: The first problem is the speed into your home is horrible, and you say to them, listen, I’m sitting next to the modem which is plugged into the NBN, which has been upgraded to the latest technology, and on 500 speed that I signed up for, I should be getting way more than 40. So that’s your first problem. And once they solve that problem, then you go, well, my bigger problem now is on the other side of the house the Wi-Fi is rubbish. So what can you do to give me— you should be giving me mesh adapters for my modem to give me better Wi-Fi throughout the home and see if they help you out.

[00:45:07] Vic: All right. There’s one thing that they have done in the meantime. The people in the shop didn’t want to help. They said they couldn’t or weren’t allowed to. But I spoke to complaints and they’ve actually given me some credits to cover the cost of a Gen 4 modem, which I haven’t bought yet.

[00:45:26] Trevor Long: Excellent. But you want a Gen 4 modem and mesh. That modem is going to be better, but it’s still not going to change the fact that you’re not going to get great Wi-Fi throughout the whole home, right? And the Gen 2 modem is, from my recollection, Wi-Fi 6, which is just a nerdy thing, but it definitely should be capable of 500 meg speeds. So that’s not the thing that’s stopping you getting 500 sitting next to the modem. So don’t let them blame that. Don’t let them say, oh no, you got to buy the modem and then we’ll check. No, no, why is this modem not working? Because, mate, if they can’t fix that problem, ditch them. Go to Aussie Broadband and I guarantee you you’ll get better speeds from Aussie Broadband. They’re just better. They just have better speeds.

[00:46:13] Vic: Well, it sounds like it could be a solution.

[00:46:15] Trevor Long: So you’ve got a bit of work to do, a couple of phone calls to make. But address Telstra on one issue at a time, otherwise you give them reason to talk about something else when the main issue’s not been solved. And the main issue is you should be getting 500 sitting there at the moment.

[00:46:30] Vic: Yeah, now when you’re looking at the numbers, the first number that goes through is 26.81, which is the ping.

[00:46:37] Vic: Okay, is that coming in or that’s going out?

[00:46:40] Trevor Long: No, ping is just— so if you go, hello, it’s how quickly you hear the hello back, right? It’s a measure of time as to how quickly it’s able to communicate with itself on the network. But the download speed is how quickly it can bring files into your home, and the upload is how quickly it can send them out of your home. So actually, the ping and the response rate, whatever they call it, not highly relevant. They are an indicator of why things aren’t going great for you. But the main thing you need is the download Mbps and the upload Mbps, and you should be showing 400+ and 50+, I would think. Probably closer— the 500 is a 50 up, so you should be seeing 400 down and 40+ up.

[00:47:31] Vic: All right, well, I think that the 40+ up is there, but the other one’s not.

[00:47:36] Trevor Long: Okay, ring them. It’s an outrage. It’s horrible. It should be better.

[00:47:41] Vic: Yeah, it is. What about this? Because they’ve already given me credits to my credit card account, $300 to cover the cost of the new modem.

[00:47:51] Trevor Long: Did they give you money to your credit card? Not Telstra credit?

[00:47:55] Vic: I think— oh, they gave me credit. I’m not sure.

[00:48:00] Trevor Long: It might be on your—

[00:48:01] Vic: oh, well, it’s on my credit card.

[00:48:03] Trevor Long: Don’t spend a cent until they fix this problem.

[00:48:05] Vic: Problem.

[00:48:06] Trevor Long: Yeah, because mate, that modem that you’ve got should be capable of 500 megabits per second.

[00:48:12] Vic: Well, just looking at my last speed test with Telstra, which was done I think this morning, okay, it’s got download speed 26.7 and upload speed 45.4.

[00:48:23] Trevor Long: There’s something wrong with the downloads, mate. Something wrong. Don’t—

[00:48:28] Vic: with the way it’s been connected, do you think, or not?

[00:48:30] Trevor Long: No, because there’s nothing complicated about your network at all. The only thing you do before you talk to them is maybe just turn off the Telstra modem and turn it back on again 10 minutes later, and then do a speed test just to check that it doesn’t need to reconnect to get the correct speed.

[00:48:46] Vic: All right, we’ll do that. All right, good luck.

[00:48:49] Trevor Long: No worries, mate. Cheers.

[00:48:50] Vic: Cheers.

[00:48:51] Trevor Long: No worries at all, happy to help. That’s an interesting one. I think there’s probably more to that story than meets the eye.

[00:48:59] Voice Over: Cars, lifestyle. This is the EFTM podcast with Trevor Long.

[00:49:04] Trevor Long: All right, stay tuned to EFTM this week, and we’ll have all the details from the Samsung announcement. If you’ve got iOS, we’re so close to releasing the app. I really am. If you’re in the public beta, you’ll see it. A few little bugs still to iron through, but I’m very keen to get that out. And because we’ve got some awesome comps in the schedule already— if you’ve got the EFTM app, you can just see what’s coming up by opening the app, clicking on the win. And if you don’t— or if you’ve already entered today’s comp, you can then just quickly look down. So actually anything I’ve logged in is listed there. So there’s a couple ahead already, and we’ve got something very big in August, so I really want to have the app sorted for that. But anyway, that’s just all in the background and planning and whatnot. It’s all good fun, all in a day’s work. Anyway, thank you for listening. Thank you for downloading. We’ll do it again back next week. Yes, because I fly back and then we’re going to Byron Bay for a BMW event. I think I’m back for Tuesday to record and then we fly away to the Gold Coast for Mercedes. So a couple of cool electric cars coming up as well. Anyway, it’s all happening, folks. Thanks for listening. Thanks for your support. Thanks for your loyalty. Back again next week.

[00:50:19] Voice Over: This is the EFTM podcast.