The EFTM podcast – Meta Ray-Bans for Good! And HP’s cracking little OmniBook 5

Meta Ray-Bans for Good! And HP's cracking little OmniBook 5

Podcast: The EFTM Podcast

Date: 10 November 2026

Host: Trevor Long

Guests: Neil Westhoff (HP), Chris Edwards (Vision Australia)

Callers: Edward, Phil

[00:00:03] VOICE OVER: The EFTM podcast. Talkback Technology. Got a question about tech? Trev’s here to help. Not sure what to buy? Ask Trev. Australia’s number one Talkback Technology podcast.

[00:00:24] VOICE OVER: Join the conversation. Head to eftm.com and click Ask Trev. Helping Australians with tech questions for over 15 years, the EFTM podcast with Trevor Long.

[00:00:45] Trevor: Real Australians with real questions every week.

[00:00:50] VOICE OVER: You can text Trev now thanks to Vodafone on 0477 657 657. The EFTM Podcast, thanks to TCL’s range of SQD Mini LED TVs, built for a brighter Aussie living room.

[00:01:07] Trevor: G’day, g’day, and welcome to the EFTM Podcast. Great to have your company. Uh, we are well into November now, folks, and that means that a truck arrived here yesterday with a pallet of boxes, and I’m like, what the hell is this? He goes, looks like printing. Oh my God, the magazine! I get, we print 20,000 magazines this year. It was only 15,000 last year. So we’re printing 20,000 magazines this year. And here it is. Ooh, I’ve got it in my hand. And so I get about 1,000 sent here to the office. Probably lose 300 of them on the launch night. Next week we’ll have the PRs and marketing people of the tech and car industry in the room running through the year in review and some awards. And so we’ll give away a bunch of them there, obviously. And then why else do I have a thousand? I mean, I don’t know why I have so many here, but anyway, well, I’ll find something for them. We’ve got about 4,000 going out in the post at the end of this week. So some of you may receive your magazines on Monday. You may receive your magazines on Monday before the official launch, really. And I’d love you to share when you get it. It’d be awesome for you to take a photo of it, share it on Instagram, tag me, tag EFTM, Trevor Long AU and EFTM. Tag us on Instagram so that I can and hopefully see all those messages and reshare them. It’s just cool to see them land in homes around Australia. Did I tell you? I think I told you last week the stats. Over 1 in 3 Australian postcodes have an EFTN Magazine reader in them. 63% of magazine readers or subscribers live in just 4 metro areas, Sydney, Melbourne, Southeast Queensland, and Perth. And we are in every state and territory. So that is very cool. Yeah, so the magazine should arrive next week. It’s super exciting to see it in the flesh. It’s weird because, yeah, it was like, it was on Canva just a few weeks ago and now here it is. Boom, done, simple, very cool. It’s one of those weird things ’cause if something changes, I can normally change it, you know, on the website, I can make a change. Anyway, can’t change nothing now. We’ve gotta give away a car now, it’s been printed. So the electric car giveaway starts next Monday, the 16th of November, folks, runs until, Valentine’s Day. So 90 days, 90 entries. But here’s the thing, on day 1 there are bonus entries. I think it’s 5, 5 bonus entries. So you got the EFTM app, it’ll— the competition will go live on Monday and then you’ll be able to click it an extra few times to get all the extra entries. There’s a total of 180 entries available to every single person. 90 of which are the each day, and then the other 90 are bonus entries. And I’ll tell you a little, little, uh, secret. Another bonus day is my birthday. So if you know when that is or can work out when that is, uh, there’s bonus entries on that day too. That’s a little while away, so don’t stress. We can, we can cover that off. But I haven’t picked all the bonus days yet. I’ll, um, I haven’t got the car yet, so I kind of want to get a car and do some videos and social. So I think the advantage for you is that you’re listening now, you’ve got the app now, hopefully you can enter from day one. There’ll be people that receive the magazine on the 27th of November because they buy something from the Gamesman and that’s when that gets delivered. So basically, by knowing that the competition opens on Monday, you’ve got the best chance. You’ve got the best chance. I am very curious, and I will be able to work this out, how many people will do the 180 entries. How many people are able to find all the bonus entries and make them all. Be fascinating, uh, and then to see who wins and whether it’s someone that did one entry or 180. Again, fascinating, the laws of probability. Got to be in it to win it, folks. It’s free, absolutely free. The only thing you’re handing over is your mobile number because we do need to validate who you are. We need real people, real Australians to enter, and that’s how we validate. So you’ve got to get an EFTM ID to log in, you’ve got to have a valid mobile number, and then you tell us who you are and where you live, and we’ll take your entries. Simple as that, folks. So that starts on Monday, Monday the 16th. So look forward to that, and hopefully you do too. BYD Atto 1 Essential. Current driveway price is $20 grand. But that ends in a few weeks. By the time we give the car away, this is a $27,000 car. So you could win it. And I don’t care what you do with it. I don’t care if you sell it that day. I don’t care if you park it in the driveway and keep it as a memento of this prestigious age of electrification. But it’ll be yours. Simple as that. If you live in Perth, we’re gonna have to spend some money shipping it over there. If you live in Brisbane, or Melbourne, I’m contemplating whether or not we have some fun and do a road trip to you. Because with 200k range, it’ll be a fun road trip. It’s a city car made for the cities, made as the runabout, perfect for, for families doing the shopping and just getting the kids to school and all those kind of things. The BYD Atto 1, cracking little car. Look forward to giving one away. Um, fun show coming up. We’ve got a lot to get through. Uh, what are we doing? We’re going to talk about the iPhone Duo, we’re going to talk about smartwatches, we’re going to talk about, um, the HP OmniBook 5, brand new laptop from HP, uh, and we’ll talk to Neil Westhoff from HP shortly about that. And we’re going to talk about smart glasses and the fact that they’re not creepy. The question on the front of the EFTM magazine is, smart glasses, creepy or cool? Well, my guest today will, I think, convince you at the very least that we shouldn’t be just marching in the streets with pickaxes and torches, having them banned. I’m sure of that. We’ll talk about the best case uses for smart glasses coming up on the EFTM podcast.

[00:07:25] VOICE OVER: You’re listening to the EFTM podcast. Join the conversation, head to eftm.com and click Ask Trev.

Edward — Buying an iPhone Duo in the US, and Vegas tips

[00:07:38] Trevor: We’d love to hear from you anytime, uh, 0477 657 657. Than the other option. Edward’s on the line. G’day, mate.

[00:07:46] Edward: Hi, Trevor. How you going?

[00:07:47] Trevor: Mate, really good. What can I do for you?

[00:07:48] Edward: Hey, I’m going to the US in a couple of months’ time, and my question was asking about the new iPhone Fold, whatever it’s called.

[00:07:56] Trevor: Duo, yes.

[00:07:57] Edward: The Duo, yes. And I noticed actually buying, they’re cheaper to buy in the US than they are over here, okay?

[00:08:03] Trevor: I mean, what is it? It’s $2,000 over there.

[00:08:06] Edward: Yeah, yeah.

[00:08:07] Trevor: What’s the direct exchange rate?

[00:08:08] Edward: I think it’s about, I’ll just say about $2,500-$3,000 all up.

[00:08:13] Trevor: With taxes?

[00:08:15] Edward: I’m not too sure. I’ll be in Las Vegas, so I’m not too sure what the taxes are over there.

[00:08:18] Trevor: Well, I would just call it 8%. They’re gonna add 8% on to whatever the exchange is. Yep. So

[00:08:25] Edward: great idea, but done. Okay, and I’ll say that too. My big question was, are they compatible with the Australian mobile network?

[00:08:33] Trevor: You buy it, you bring it back. It’ll work, um, but it won’t work fully. So, okay, fun fact, there’s 4 iPhone Duo models. Okay, I’m not talking about size and colors, I’m talking about across the, across the world. There’s 4 different models. Uh, there’s a China one, let’s assume that’s been pared back in a big way. Um, there’s the US and Puerto Rico, and then there’s a Canada, Mexico, Japan,

[00:08:58] Edward: right?

[00:08:58] Trevor: Um, and then there’s pretty much global, which includes Australia. And the big difference is always the mobile bands that they support.

[00:09:06] Edward: Yep.

[00:09:07] Trevor: So what I mean by it’ll work is when you come back, your phone will be like, here’s 4G, I found that. And then you’ll be like, why am I not getting 5G properly? It’s because the US version has millimeter wave 5G and we use sub-6 primarily over here.

[00:09:19] Edward: Okay.

[00:09:20] Trevor: So basically in each region, the phones are designed for the region and the compatibility of the mobile bands in those regions. As I said, it’ll work, but some things might not work. And then you’ll come across the problem of if it isn’t hasn’t been authorized or tested by the telcos fully, they may kick it off the network because it doesn’t meet our triple zero guidelines. So if it hasn’t, if it hasn’t been correctly engineered to utilize the triple zero network correctly, the telcos are required by law to kick it off the network. And basically you’ll have a phone that simply can’t connect to, uh, so

[00:09:58] Edward: it’ll be a brick

[00:09:59] Trevor: phone basically in Australia. Well, no, it’ll work on Wi-Fi, it’ll turn on, but it won’t use the mobile networks.

[00:10:04] Edward: Oh, okay, so there goes that whole theory then.

[00:10:06] Trevor: Yeah, were you trying to do that to save money or to get one earlier?

[00:10:09] Edward: Oh, to save money basically. But if I bought it here anyway, I could just get the GST refund on the way out anyway, couldn’t

[00:10:16] Trevor: I? Do you know what? I wonder, you know, JB’s at the airport have the old duty-free store. I wonder if they, yeah, buy duty-free at the airport.

[00:10:26] Edward: Yeah, okay.

[00:10:27] Trevor: The biggest challenge is stock.

[00:10:30] Edward: Yeah. And also too, my biggest challenge at the moment is reading the reviews.

[00:10:35] Trevor: You’re not happy with it?

[00:10:36] Edward: Oh, I’ve been like the, the screens cracking and that sort of stuff.

[00:10:40] Trevor: Well, look, I acknowledge that the screens have definitely cracked on many people’s phones, but at this point I would put it in the hundreds at best.

[00:10:49] Edward: Yep.

[00:10:49] Trevor: And you can tell it’s a fault. Like you can absolutely tell. I’ve seen videos of it happening, like clicking for the first time and breaking. And like, I’ve been using it nonstop for about 3 weeks now and I’ve never had any sense of that, seen it, have been doing a fold test. I think there are 350,000 folds on it now. Okay, so it’s clearly not an inherent problem, but it’s definitely a problem. Mate, the good thing is that I would say to anyone buying a Duo thinking about that is, mate, Apple will replace that thing in a heartbeat because they don’t want the drama.

[00:11:22] Edward: Like, yeah, and I don’t want the drama for the CFO at home either.

[00:11:25] Trevor: Well, that’s the, that’s the first hurdle. That’s not the second hurdle, mate. That’s the first hurdle to get through. What does she want that you haven’t been letting her get?

[00:11:34] Edward: Nothing much at the moment. She’s got a new car.

[00:11:36] Trevor: Mate, it’s the old switcheroo.

[00:11:38] Edward: Yes, correcto mundo.

[00:11:39] Trevor: What car did you get her?

[00:11:41] Edward: I know you didn’t like— I got a JACUZE J7. We got

[00:11:44] Trevor: J7. I’ve driven that one. Is it electric hybrid?

[00:11:48] Edward: Yes, the plug-in hybrid one.

[00:11:49] Trevor: Mate, they’re a nice looking car.

[00:11:52] Edward: Yeah, it was a team. They call the team Land Rover, don’t they?

[00:11:55] Trevor: Oh, that’s the bigger one. Yes, I think I was there at a launch of that. Is it got a third row or only two rows?

[00:12:01] Edward: No, it’s only two rows. It’s only because my wife and my— because we downsized last year and moved up to Central Coast from Asquith. So we got rid of the old Merc and because she’s getting a bit older and she doesn’t like hopping down in her car anymore, she wants to get up to it.

[00:12:15] Trevor: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And what’s it like to drive and park? Like all the tech in it?

[00:12:19] Edward: Yeah, good. But you know what? I did— my old C-Class had the automatic parallel parking, but this one doesn’t.

[00:12:26] Trevor: Oh, so many cars have it today. It’s kind of weird not to have it, doesn’t it?

[00:12:29] Edward: Yeah, correct. Yeah. And also too, she does like the— you can plug in, works on about 120 kilometers on the plug-in. Yep. But she goes up to Port Macquarie pretty often, so she doesn’t— she likes to have— having the range, 1,100 kilometers on the range. That’s right.

[00:12:49] Trevor: They call it a super hybrid, don’t they? They love that term in the Chery, JACU family, the super hybrid.

[00:12:53] Edward: Yes. But there are a couple of things I know I’m getting right off the conversation.

[00:12:57] Trevor: That’s right.

[00:12:58] Edward: She doesn’t like the memory in the old C-Class. The memory was we could have it like in sports mode, that sort of thing. But this one, you got to like click everything back into place when you get back into the car.

[00:13:11] Trevor: So does it remember seat memory? But that’s it, basically.

[00:13:14] Edward: Basically, yes.

[00:13:15] Trevor: Yeah. Yeah. It’s very rare for cars to remember your driving mode. I’ve noticed, weirdly, the Honda Super one I’m driving, every time it remembers I want to be in sports mode. And I love that.

[00:13:26] Edward: Yeah. This one just says economy.

[00:13:30] Trevor: Yeah. No, I think I might go with economy. You’ve got 1,100 kilometers range. What do we want economy for?

[00:13:34] Edward: Correct. That’s right.

[00:13:36] Trevor: What color did you get, mate?

[00:13:38] Edward: It’s like a bluey.

[00:13:40] Trevor: Okay. I was just going to say, if you got that weird green, that’s a weird looking. It’s a light blue. See, there’s a light green. It’s also a shade of yellowy gold. And it’s like, guys, what did you do to this color?

[00:13:51] Edward: Yes, correct.

[00:13:53] Trevor: Blue’s nice.

[00:13:54] Edward: Yeah, I didn’t mind it either because when we were getting rid of this, because the old Mercedes is getting up to 100,000 kilometers, right? And I said to my wife, you know what, when that thing gets 100Ks, I know things are going to start going wrong with it.

[00:14:07] Trevor: Yeah, they start adding up in price.

[00:14:10] Edward: Yes. And that’s why we basically swapped over and like the end, the swap over another C-Class down was like 90-odd grand. I just can’t justify that price.

[00:14:18] Trevor: Yeah. And you look at this and what’s this thing, 40-odd? 45.

[00:14:21] Edward: Yeah. By the time we traded in, I think I was 30 on the road.

[00:14:25] Trevor: Yeah. I mean, that’s insane value for the size and the quality and the fit out. And you know what you say to yourself every time you’re annoyed that it doesn’t remember your drive mode? You go, we saved 50 grand on this car.

[00:14:36] Edward: Yeah. And also, but the other thing was my wife was a bit worried about these new cars. They’re going to be like an old iPhone 8. They won’t be updating like the

[00:14:47] Trevor: Yeah,

[00:14:48] Edward: the technology after a while.

[00:14:50] Trevor: But I mean, what’s wrong with the technology right now?

[00:14:53] Edward: No, nothing.

[00:14:54] Trevor: But see, it’s different because you don’t, you don’t get in and out of cars like you do see other people’s phones. You don’t know what you’re missing. And, and your apps— so I think the real reason that an iPhone 8 feels old today is because there’s apps that won’t work with it.

[00:15:06] Edward: Yes, that’s right.

[00:15:07] Trevor: It’s not like suddenly the apps that are on your car are not going to work.

[00:15:12] Edward: No.

[00:15:12] Trevor: So I feel pretty good about it.

[00:15:14] Edward: And then they have the over-the-air updates anyway, I’m assuming.

[00:15:17] Trevor: For, you know what, let’s say they only last 5 years.

[00:15:20] Edward: So,

[00:15:21] Trevor: so

[00:15:21] Edward: what, the old car lasted 10 years?

[00:15:24] Trevor: But no, but these software updates.

[00:15:26] Edward: Yeah, yeah, right.

[00:15:28] Trevor: Like, who cares if you’re not getting software updates after 5 years? Still, car still drives, car still works, still does cruise control, still does all those things. I don’t see it as being that big an issue like, like it is with mobile phones.

[00:15:39] Edward: Hey, and also another query I got. I’m getting right off the topic right now. Where do you reckon we’re going to be staying? Was it the Fontainebleau in Las Vegas?

[00:15:48] Trevor: Fontainebleau.

[00:15:49] Edward: That’s the one. Yes,

[00:15:50] Trevor: mate. That’s a gorgeous motel. My Lord.

[00:15:53] Edward: Oh, is it? Yeah. And because— and my wife is worried it’s going to be like off the Strip.

[00:15:58] Trevor: So it’s the far north of the Strip. Yes. It’s not really Yeah, I mean, from there you could— it’s a block and a half walk to the Wynn, which is beautiful. It’s the same walk to Fashion Show Mall, which is a nice shopping center she can enjoy. I probably wouldn’t suggest walking the Strip from there because it’s a long way back.

[00:16:20] Edward: Yeah, okay.

[00:16:21] Trevor: But you know what you do? Walk across the road from the Fontainebleau is the Westgate. It’s the old Las Vegas Hilton. That’s where we— that’s where I stay every year for the convention center because it’s The convention center’s right there as well. You, you won’t miss that. It’s big. But the monorail is over there at the convention, at the Westgate. Okay, find the back door to the Fontainebleau because all these hotels, they want you to come out the main entrance, right? I bet you there’s a back door or a side entrance. There’s a side entrance that comes out on, I think it’s called Elvis Presley Boulevard, between the convention center and the Fontainebleau. And you walk out there, you walk half a block, you’re at the Westgate, jump on the monorail, take the monorail all the way down the Strip and then enjoy all the main casinos and walk through them, do all that stuff. And then a different day, go outside and walk down to the Wynn and to the Encore, to Fashion Show Mall. Maybe you do the Palazzo and the Venetian. Circus Circus is across the road from the Fontainebleau. And then Old Vegas, the proper Old Vegas, is a cab ride or an Uber ride uptown into Fremont Street. So you got, there’s 3 nights of wandering because you never wander in the daytime in Vegas. It’s an ugly city in the daytime.

[00:17:36] Edward: And probably hot, too hot too, because we’re going in July, August.

[00:17:39] Trevor: So yeah, so it’s not a fun place to be because it’s not as like, I love the fanciful nature of Vegas, right? It’s like going to Disneyland because it’s just, it’s not real. It’s surreal. And when you walk on the Strip of Vegas, you’re like, oh, these lights, it’s crazy. And when you’re in the casinos, it’s okay to walk through casinos in the daytime because you don’t know what day, what time it is outside. But don’t go exploring in the daytime. But yeah, mate, you’re— there’s 4 days, there’s 3 days just looking at the casinos and enjoying yourself. How long are you there for?

[00:18:10] Edward: About 5 days, I think it is. We’re going to Allegiant Stadium. So that’s another part of it.

[00:18:17] Trevor: What, are you seeing something?

[00:18:19] Edward: Yeah, the Oasis concert.

[00:18:21] Trevor: Oh, wow.

[00:18:21] Edward: Yeah.

[00:18:22] Trevor: So just to be clear, you’re the— absolute opposite end of the Strip to Allegiant Stadium.

[00:18:27] Edward: That’s it. I know. And I was going, oh, how much is it? And the thing is, like, not like Australia, I can get my Opal card out and just tap on, tap off.

[00:18:34] Trevor: You know what, the, the monorail’s not horrible. The monorail doesn’t go as far as— so the monorail from the convention center that you would get doesn’t go all the way to the Mandalay Bay. There’s like a— it takes you down like to the MGM, and then you go through the MGM and walk across the road to the Excalibur and What’s the pyramid one called? La Luxor. The

[00:18:56] Edward: Sphinx? Oh no, the Sphinx.

[00:18:58] Trevor: And there’s a tram within those that takes you down to the Mandalay Bay. ‘Cause you can walk from the Mandalay Bay across to the Allegiant. Allegiant. But mate, just time. It’s all about time. Just—

[00:19:09] Edward: Yeah, I know.

[00:19:10] Trevor: You’re in no rush, mate.

[00:19:12] Edward: And it’s also what the CFO wants to do as well.

[00:19:14] Trevor: Yeah, well, you know, if she wants to get Ubers everywhere, go for your life.

[00:19:17] Edward: But it’s a

[00:19:18] Trevor: weirdly walkable place, Vegas, through casinos. You could spend 2 hours walking from one end of the Strip to the other and just walk through casinos.

[00:19:27] Edward: Yeah, I know. I’ve done the Macau, so I know exactly what you’re talking about.

[00:19:31] Trevor: Mate, enjoy. Sorry to give you weird Vegas advice there, but I have been there 20 times, so.

[00:19:37] Edward: What about restaurants?

[00:19:38] Trevor: I’ve been married there twice. Do you like a steak?

[00:19:41] Edward: Of course I do.

[00:19:42] Trevor: Mate, go online now because they book out. Golden Steer.

[00:19:48] Edward: Golden Steer.

[00:19:48] Trevor: Golden Steer. And it’s up your— it’s, mate, it’s up your way. So it’s that end of the Strip. You could probably walk there from the Fontainebleau, but certainly it’s a short cab ride, mate. It’s a classic old school steakhouse. Every booth, and I mean booth, like velour— sorry, not velour, but leather booths has like a celebrity like Muhammad Ali or Frank Sinatra or someone, Mario Andretti. And mate, the steak is unbelievable. They can prepare a Caesar salad tableside. Beautiful. It’s the greatest steak restaurant in

[00:20:19] Edward: the world. The Golden Steer. Golden Steer, mate. Thank you.

[00:20:21] Trevor: Get on it.

[00:20:21] Edward: Thank you very much.

[00:20:22] Trevor: All right, buddy.

[00:20:23] Edward: Thanks, Trevor. Thanks for your time.

[00:20:24] Trevor: Thanks, mate. Cheers. Have a good one.

[00:20:26] Edward: Cheers. Bye.

[00:20:26] Trevor: Anytime. Anytime. I don’t know how we got onto that, if I’m honest. What did we originally talk about, Edward? Oh, the buying an iPhone overseas. Ah, we can rabbit on. I do love Vegas. So there is that.

[00:20:42] VOICE OVER: The EFTM podcast. Thanks to TCL. Brighter Days Epic Plays.

Neil Westhoff (HP) — The HP OmniBook 5

[00:20:52] Trevor: Great to have your company, and I look forward to talking to you. If you’ve got a tech question, get in touch. Just send me a text, 0477 657657. Whether you’re in the market to buy something and you need my help, or you’ve bought something cool you want to brag about, or you’re having a problem with something, I’m happy to help wherever I can. You can download the EFT map and just click Ask Trev. It’s been a huge year, I think, for computers, for PCs, for laptops, and especially to be honest, in a lower point of the market. I do spend my year, and my next guest will maybe roll his eyes a bit at this, but I spend my year asking PC companies to send me their coolest products to show on the TV or wherever. And often I get sent $3,000, $4,000 laptops, and they’re amazing, they really are. But I think the bulk of the buyers out there are spending $800 to $1,500 odd dollars, and that’s where I wanna be, and that’s where I wanna see the market grow. We’ve had some big, big improvements in that space this year. So that’s one of the key reasons I wanted to get on our next guest, and that is Neil Westhoff, who’s head of personal systems at HP Australia and New Zealand. Neil, g’day mate, how are you?

[00:21:55] Neil Westhoff: G’day, thank you, Graeme. Yeah, good, good for a Monday.

[00:21:58] Trevor: Exactly, mate. I think I just wanna get straight to it. The OmniBook 5. Now we’re on a video call, people are just listening to this, but I’ve had this for, I don’t know, a few days. And there’s a couple of things that I, I love about the OmniBook 5. It’s not the first OmniBook, not the first OmniBook 5, but it’s an important, I think, reset of this market space. And because I think on price, I think on design and on features for a $1,500 laptop, this thing really stands out now. Was that a, was it a focus point for the business to be able to not just hit a price point, but to actually hit a few different targets in that price point?

[00:22:39] Neil Westhoff: Yeah, Trevor, thank you. And I’m really happy to hear your already positive experience after a few days with the device. And for sure, I think at HP, right, every time we look at when we’re designing new products, we look at the personas that we’re designing for, right? We don’t want to create hardware specifications for the sake of it. The starting point has to be that it has to be what people need to accomplish with the device that they’re using. So in this case, we really wanted to cater towards people that are at the beginning of their laptop journey, or including, for example, university students or people that are starting their careers and entering the category, wanted to still give them that premium considered experience in the device. And I think if you look at the OmniBook 5, it really caters towards that, right? It caters with that with the aluminum chassis, caters with that with the OLED display that gives you vibrant colors, the multiple ports you have, portability, the battery life. I mean, all of it is really designed around giving that premium experience to a user.

[00:23:35] Trevor: Because a premium experience is sometimes weirdly a peer pressure perception problem as well. You know, you don’t wanna rock up up to year 9, let alone your first 2 years of university with a laptop that frankly looks like you didn’t have the money to buy the cool thing that everyone else has got. It shouldn’t be that way. I think we all agree on that, but it is in some places. And so to be able to create that premium experience genuinely in a device at this price point, I think really boosts the market. And I truly believe in a rising tide lifts all boats. I think that the pressure in the market, in the PC space, the laptop space has been pretty strong over the last year last couple of years. And this is good for the market. It’s good for consumers, Neil.

[00:24:20] Neil Westhoff: No, 100%. I mean, I couldn’t agree with you more. It definitely helps lift the market. And again, I look, I think for the users in the market, we also want to make sure that we have the breadth of our portfolio to cater towards their needs wherever, whatever their budget may be. And to your point, there’s budget and solutions to go way up the stack and become even more premium. But for this category, we definitely want to cater towards that maximizing that price point and that experience at the same time. And I think with the OmniBook 5, I mean, obviously from an HP perspective, we believe we, we nailed that brief.

[00:24:53] Trevor: Yeah, it’s, it’s an interesting one because it’s not just about specs. And you mentioned like this thing on one side has HDMI and 2 USB ports as well as a 3.5mm on the other side. That’s pretty much everything you could need at a lot, frankly, outside of school as well, because HDMI is a big one. For laptops, right? People often overlook it, but when you are working or you’re in school and you want to just plug in and display on the, on the big screen or whatever it is, it’s a game changer when you don’t have to go fumbling for a dongle, which is essentially something that you, you do play up a little bit. I was reading a fact sheet or a data sheet about it. I don’t know if this is on the public website and things, but you know, you talk about all the ports, zero dongles. Now that’s a direct attack on some competitors, you know, Apple being the most, most widely publicized one because so much of that market requires a huge third-party set of dongles. And you’re saying we don’t, we don’t need you to buy that. We’ve got you covered.

[00:25:50] Neil Westhoff: Correct. And that’s the whole point of this device. We wanted to make sure that for those, for those personas, for those people that are, you know, either university students or early career that want to have that mix of portability, of being able to move around and use that device in different locations in between lectures or as they’re moving about in between whatever they’re doing as well, whether it’s their side side hustle, if they’re in their early careers or anything else, that they have this device with them and they don’t have to have the cumbersome explanation with, for example, to your point, a dongle. No need for that.

[00:26:21] Trevor: Can we talk about the colors for a moment before I talk about power and performance? Smoke Silver, Starlit Blue, which by the way, if I was buying right now, that’d be my pick. It looks gorgeous. I’m rocking this Soft Honeydew, which we’re going to— I’m going to call green, but you would definitely call Soft Honeydew. I need you to tell me what the, what the fourth color is because I would just say pink, but it’s a very specific pink.

[00:26:44] Neil Westhoff: Apparently, Trevor, it’s Peony Pink. Peony?

[00:26:48] Trevor: I mean, has anyone explained that to you? Has someone from Pantone or Dulux or someone with their color cards come in and said, can we describe to you what Peony Pink is?

[00:26:57] Neil Westhoff: No. And if, and if, and if I would probably have to have the marketers come in here and explain the naming convention around the Peony Pink, because I’ll be very honest with you, from my perspective, it’s a really beautiful color pink. Now it has a name to it. Same with honey, soft honeydew, right? I mean, to your point, you mentioned it’s green. I mean, you know, you look at it in the store shelf, you’ll probably say it’s green, but it’s soft honeydew.

[00:27:21] Trevor: Yeah. I’ve just done a quick Google and thanks to our good friends at AI, I’m reading that peonies are long-lived flowering plants and I’m seeing a photo and it’s a pink, but it’s a solid pink on the inside, washed to white on the outside. So I think that’s I think that’s what they’re trying to suggest is it’s not a strong pink would be the best way to describe it. It’s quite a washed out subtle pink, but it’s still as pink as anything, folks. If you think you’re getting something slightly not pink, trust me, it’s 100% pink. But again, that color selection is something important in retail, is it not? Because I assume that moms and dads taking their kids in for a laptop laptop or, you know, as you said, an early career or university student, you know, they’re trying to find something that’s going to hit their personal brand. You know, weirdly, I think that’s a real thing for people. It’s like, oh, and, you know, people put stickers all over their laptops, but there’s still something sitting underneath it. And to offer that is critical.

[00:28:22] Neil Westhoff: Oh, 100%. I think this, this, these 4 colors in this device is really about also giving people choices, right? It is giving them choices to express themselves, to choose a color of a device that really fits their personality as they go about and use it within their day-to-day lives. So yeah, that’s definitely a very, very conscious choice to give them that option and give them those different options. And, you know, I think you mentioned your preference is Starlit Blue. I have to say that I personally really love Soft Honeydew as a color.

[00:28:53] Trevor: I’ll do you a swap then. Hey, it’s all well and good to have a beautiful looking laptop, a great design. You mentioned the chassis. but performance is critical, and especially in this current age of laptops. Copilot Plus and all these different words are thrown around, but performance is, is a hard thing to measure until you’re using a device. But this has got an Intel processor. I feel like, and as much as I have great respect for all the different processors that we now have in the market, and Intel’s lost a lot of market share because of that, you know, rise in other brands. I still feel like the general public have an inbuilt trust in Intel because of a decade or more long branding experience and marketing experience. So there’s a bit of faith and trust in that. And it’s, it’s not unwavering too, because this thing will do what everyone needs to do in those kind of education and early career spaces.

[00:29:48] Neil Westhoff: 100%. And look, to your point, Intel still is very, very dominant within the Australian marketplace when it comes to a brand. And obviously also a very strong partner of us in terms of our portfolio setup and where we choose to use them. I think this particular device, to your point, allows people to have the right power in their hands, fit for purpose technology, fit for purpose that enables them to use that device towards their needs, right? In this case, the personas that we built them for, which is these university students, these early career people that want to have this device.

[00:30:21] Trevor: I think about AI because you do describe this as an AI PC, and I, I respect the power of on-device processing where it exists, but I still look at what I’m doing with AI, and I would prophesize or, or can, you know, assume that that early career student, um, usage is quite close to what I do, which is pretty much just jumping into Claude or ChatGPT or whatever and getting it to do things, and not a lot of that is happening on device yet. So while there’s a lot of power and performance in both the CPU and the GPU, it’s all there really at that stage of life for that persona as you describe them. It’s more about the cloud compute in many ways. So we don’t— while it does have AI capabilities, let’s be clear, it’s more about what it can do outside of that. I would have thought AI is not its number one selling point because actually most of the AI usage for those people is in the cloud.

[00:31:18] Neil Westhoff: Yeah, yeah. And look, the device has 15 to 16 TOPS on device, as you rightfully point out. It’s an AI-capable PC. And to your point, I mean, generally speaking, a lot of AI usage is still definitely inferencing towards the cloud at this moment in time. Now, I think what people look for when they’re looking at these devices, to your point, is, is it fit for purpose for the next couple of years that I’m using it and the way I’m using that device. And for these typical personas, you’re spot on. This type of behavior would definitely be a lot of cloud inferencing, but also with on-device capabilities. And again, if you have different needs, then obviously within our portfolio, you can extend upwards towards having much more stronger capabilities on device in case you want to work towards that. And for sure, the future of AI is going to be hybrid, as you can definitely read from a lot of examples about tokenomics, but that’s really when you go more into the commercial enterprise space.

[00:32:12] Trevor: Yeah, I think, and that’s my point, is when we’re talking about this audience, and again, here’s another thing I picked up in, in, in just reading the brief on this device. It’s not something that I look for in a computer, and I think generationally there’s probably a lot of people who aren’t looking at this, but a younger generation are far more eco-invested than me, and they can go, hang on, this thing’s This thing has recycled aluminium in it. So this is, this is not just, you know, a better chassis, but there’s some thought gone into that. And I think you do that as well with your packaging and a lot of other things. So it’s kind of fascinating to me how you’ve— if you line up all of the, the potential features of this, of which it’s very difficult— who do you market to and which feature do you market to where? But if people are actually going, okay, I want this, this, this, and this, and that list grows, you start to tick more of the boxes because of things things like your environmental credentials.

[00:33:04] Neil Westhoff: Yeah, 100%. And look, we continuously work across our portfolio to improve the recyclability of material usage and delve into the overall sustainability of our portfolio, including the packaging which you mentioned. So that’s an ongoing process for every new product that we introduce into the market, and definitely, of course, front and center for a product like the OmniBook 5. And so, yeah, for, uh, and of course that’s also not just because we want to do it ourselves as a company, but we also know that I think the general population wants to see companies invest more in making the devices more sustainable and using more recycled material and having packaging that is more sustainable as well. So all those things we look at when we’re developing our solutions and of course also embedded into the OmniBook 5.

[00:33:48] Trevor: I want to make an observation of the laptop market to you and you know, you can skirt around it or comment as you wish. I feel like the, the, the general PC laptop market is, um, is flooded with devices, many of which are similar because of the way our retail markets work. So, and I think for the average audience member listening, you know that you can price match and get discounts at different stores. And, and one of the reasons that model numbers aren’t shared across, uh, you know, different retail, uh, presences is because it’s a very specific model. It’s a It’s the same device with a slightly different spec so that they’re not the same, and that allows price competitiveness to stay at a static rate. I see great benefit though, Neil, in you having flagship devices like OmniBook 5, which is just— this is a device, it’s the OmniBook 5— and, and maybe more of them so that, you know, there is this flagship to the HP range. Because with the greatest respect, I feel like I would have struggled to name a device. If someone said to me, oh, go and look at, you know, which laptop should I, should I buy? Often, you know, Apple has a very clear set of, set of products, and while there is millions of them in, in certain ranges, they have certain names. Is there, is there a need for you to not rationalize the, the market but over-brand and hype, hype up individual model brands like the Omnibook 5? And maybe there’s one below it, and maybe there’s, there’s there’s pro level, or am I just missing that? And are we all just missing that because of the huge market that we exist in where there is just so much choice?

[00:35:27] Neil Westhoff: I think there is a lot of choice, but let’s not skirt along that topic, right? There is a lot of choice. And I guess when you’re a user, when you’re looking through the shelves on the retail and you’re looking for a right device for you, then where do you start? Of course, depending on the retailer, you can ask for advice. Or you have to sort of do a lot of your searching online yourself. What I always try to look at is, you know, think about as a user, what is it that you are looking for? What is it looking for obviously in, in the, the straightforward specifications, but also, um, what are you looking for in terms of the brand and you’re familiar, familiar with the brand and the brand that you trust? I think for us, to your point of do you create solutions where there’s Halo products and Hero products? Yeah, we look at that within our portfolio and we definitely try and position that, those is in the market. And Omni Group Farc is a great example, of course, to your point of a product that’s very much there and in the market and available and is different in terms of the color usage and the capabilities and the premium experience that it gives you. And so that ends up being a choice for the user to say, does that fit for my purpose? Does it suit the needs? You mentioned yourself earlier, it might not be what I’m looking for, but I know that there’s a lot of people out there in the market that will be looking for a device like like this because it does give them that premium experience at that price point and gives them the capabilities that fit, that suits their needs. Will there be alternatives in the market to that? I don’t necessarily comment on the competition because there is competition. I believe that you have to focus on your own strengths. But within that portfolio and within that segment, I believe with the on-the-book flight, we have a very strong, strong candidate to suit what people are looking for.

[00:37:01] Trevor: And we’re in such a different space now. You mentioned walking into a store and getting advice. I mean, And it’s hard to do these days. A lot of the time it’s hard to get attention of a storeholder. But I also think people have pretty much narrowed it down by the time they get there. And one of the things I say to people, Neil, just on this show alone is, look, I’ll give you, I’ll narrow it down for you. I’ll give you 3 to look at and they might be across 2 brands. It might be across 1, it might be across 3. But the fact is you’re gonna wanna go in and pick it up somewhere. Like that is, this is a lot of money to spend. You’re gonna wanna go in and pick it up somewhere. The challenge I think for people is there’s just so, as you said, there’s so much. If you live in an area where your JB Hi-Fi store, for example, is smaller than the one, you know, 10 kilometers away, they might have less range and therefore it’s harder to find. But the amount of data and information that exists online today makes it very easy for people to really narrow down that choice, doesn’t it? And so I think you would probably hear from retailers that they come to the store knowing what they want or very close to knowing these days.

[00:38:01] Neil Westhoff: They do. They do. But then to your point, it is the touch and feel. It is the how does it feel when I’m, when I’m holding it in my hands? Because you can, you can look at weight on a spec sheet, but what does it feel like when you’re actually holding it in your hand? You can look at a trackpad on an image, but how does it feel when you’re actually using it? And similar to the keys and, you know, anything else with the with the device for that matter. Right. So I think that depending on the individual, some people will go and make that decision completely online. But to your point, there’s many individuals, and particularly in this category, that will want to go to the store, if not just for looking at the color in real life. Right. Because there’s, I think, nothing more exciting to see a product and the color that you’re looking at for whatever product it is, by the way. I have that myself as well when it when it really comes down to color, I like to see it with my own eyes physically in front of me to really see if that is the experience that I’ve seen on the images.

[00:38:55] Trevor: A TikTok video might have had a filter on it that changes that, that pink to pop far more than it really does. And that may actually disappoint you when you see it in the flesh because the internet’s not real, as we all well know.

[00:39:09] Neil Westhoff: Well, and the flip side of that is back to the Peony Pink color, right, is some Some people might find that if you think about that and you see it on images, it might be too distracting if you’re opening up the laptop and working with it. But if you truly see it, you might see it as actually not distracting at all and it’s actually very much fit for purpose and that might actually change your choice at that moment in time, right? So that is typically where I think that looking at that device in store will definitely help.

[00:39:33] Trevor: Just finally, is the market strong? You know, we hear a lot about cost of living, we hear a lot about price problems. This device is very, very sharp price-wise. So you’ve obviously done very well to get it at this price. But is it a struggle at the moment because of the demands on the market and the demands on the tech industry generally?

[00:39:56] Neil Westhoff: Well, I think there’s a couple of things, right? You’re obviously— you and many others are still familiar with the components challenges that we have, although that is getting— that is getting better in terms of visibility of what is available and allows us to actually make sure that our products are available in the market, right? And so that’s one aspect. The second aspect to your point is we can’t ignore the macroeconomic situation that we see around the world that’s also impacting Australia, right? I am a homeowner myself. I’m very familiar with the interest rates that have been increasing, right? And that weighs on everyone. So I think in that sense that, you know, we know we can see the data on on consumer sentiment. So there is pressure in the market from that matter. But what I then look at from an HP perspective is, do we have the right portfolio that at least for those people that are in the market looking for device can look at our solution and basically decide that is what I need for my needs and that is the best solution for it, right? So I mean, if you look at it from a vendor perspective, right, there’s market share that everyone tracks. And I believe we always have to make sure that we can grow within that space. And to do that, we need to have the best solutions available for, for the customers to choose from. And that’s what we try and achieve.

[00:41:02] Trevor: Well, it feels to me like the OmniBook 5 should very much help you with that challenge because it’s a gorgeous device too. I think it has that street appeal and let’s just call it store appeal. You know, you walk in and it’s a sea of grey and silver colour alone, but then when you pick it up and you realise it’s not plastic, there’s a lot of things that in those first 30 seconds of touchpoint, you realize, wait a minute, this is working really well for me. I mean, it’s so lightweight. The screen, as you said, is OLED. It pops when you open it up. The keys are color-coordinated to the, to the color you’ve chosen. These are all great things, and I, I just think that once people get that in-store feeling for it, it’ll, it’ll do very well for you, Neil. So congratulations to the product team on that one, and, and generally on the, on the performance performance in the market, mate. It’s all looking good for another strong year ahead. And I think if that product alone is indication of what else might be to come, then I’d be pretty excited for what HP has to come, mate. Really good to catch up with you as always.

[00:42:02] Neil Westhoff: Thank you, Trevor. Appreciate your time.

[00:42:07] VOICE OVER: The EFTM Podcast. Thanks to TCL.

Phil — A small smartwatch for his wife

[00:42:12] Trevor: Taking your calls if you wanna get in touch Just send me a text. 0477 657 657. Funky Phil, what did you think of that sting, mate?

[00:42:21] Phil: It’s getting better every time.

[00:42:22] Trevor: I don’t know. That one isn’t growing on me as much. Phil, what can I do for you, mate?

[00:42:26] Phil: All personal taste, isn’t it?

[00:42:28] Trevor: Exactly.

[00:42:29] Phil: Alrighty. The Minister for War and Finance has had a smartwatch which has died. It’s one of the Fitbits and being all plastic, you know, eventually they get brittle and bang. Done. So I’m looking to get her something probably better. Metal, metal body or metal chassis, as she called it. Small because she’s only small. Requirements are probably best battery life. I said, what do you want? And she said, all the time. And I thought, okay, most of them are going to have that, aren’t they, darling? Yeah. So the time, heart rate, ECG, that’s probably the main requirements.

[00:43:10] Trevor: And is she a Samsung or an Apple user?

[00:43:12] Phil: She’s got a Samsung phone. That’s a bit of a love-hate relationship.

[00:43:19] Trevor: And is she more on the side of the fitness strap or the watch? Is she thinking now she’s used one of those, she knows the stats and stuff, but has she considered an actual smartwatch like a round big— you know?

[00:43:31] Phil: Yeah, that’s what she’s— yeah, that’s what I’m thinking and she’s thinking now.

[00:43:35] Trevor: Most of the— but there are still Fitbits and bands and those things, but most of those are now coming without a screen. So there’s this trend, you might have seen people wearing, certainly athletes and celebrities wearing the Whoop, which is like a band, it’s about a centimetre and a half thick that wraps around your wrist and it’s got all the smarts in it. And it’s unbelievable, its app tells you how good you’re going in the day and all that kind of rubbish. But there’s actually, they’ve kind of gone with that’s the style now, or smartwatch. And personally—

[00:44:04] Phil: Probably, yeah, really smartwatch, you know, small smartwatches.

[00:44:06] Trevor: I think smartwatch is the better go. Company makes a smartwatch that is smaller. So for— they never say men’s and women’s, do they? But let’s be honest, the 42mm watch is for women and the 44, 46 is for men. Like, that’s what it is. Um, if I wore a 42mm watch, I feel like it was too small for me. If my wife wore my, you know, Apple Watch Ultra, I think she’d look ridiculous in it for her little wrist.

[00:44:31] Phil: Yeah, we’re probably even thinking smaller if possible because she’s, you know, quite a slight young lady. I mean, even smaller. And as I said, metal frame, you know. So

[00:44:40] Trevor: I— have you gone and looked at a Google Pixel Watch?

[00:44:45] Phil: No, I haven’t looked. The only one I’ve really looked at is Withings.

[00:44:48] Trevor: Oh, mate, Withings, you know what? That’s an absolutely brilliant idea because they make gorgeous watches that just happen to be super smart, right? Weirdly, that’s the kind of secondary effect of them. What’s the smallest one they make though? I know they make some gorgeous ones, but— well, there’s a 38mm, there’s a 38mm rose gold.

[00:45:12] Phil: Yeah, um, ScanWatch 2.

[00:45:14] Trevor: Yep, that’s the one. Um, it’s— here’s what’s great about it, it’s a physical analog watch with real hands that tells the time, but then it is—

[00:45:22] Phil: that’s what she probably likes.

[00:45:24] Trevor: Pretty sure the ScanWatch 2 will do everything including ECG. Yeah, I’m just checking, does it do ECG? It might not do ECG, but it does everything else, mate. It does, you know, 24/7 temperature tracking, sleep tracking, activity tracking, all that jazz.

[00:45:40] Phil: There’s nothing in— I know you’re a watch man, so like, you know, TAG and all that sort of thing, none of them are doing smartwatches that if I wanted to sort of spoil up?

[00:45:47] Trevor: Not small, and the word on the street is TAG’s pulling out of smartwatches as well, so much to my disappointment. Oh really? Yeah, look, it’s it’s a tough market to crack when Apple and Samsung are in it, you know.

[00:45:59] Phil: Yeah, but their battery life’s also pretty darn ordinary, isn’t it?

[00:46:02] Trevor: Yeah, it’s a day and a half, which is why I’m blown away that things like the Withings hasn’t, haven’t caught on more because they, they are like, it’s, it’s a month of battery life or more. It’s, it’s phenomenal.

[00:46:15] Phil: I like about it as well. So, okay, so nothing else around other than that really that I can sort of consider?

[00:46:20] Trevor: That’s your best option in terms of what would work for her. I’m just trying to think whether the— no, they had one called the Nova, but I think it might be a bit bigger. It was just a bit more blingy. Is she a gold or a silver kind of jewelry?

[00:46:35] Phil: Probably more the black.

[00:46:37] Trevor: Right. Okay.

[00:46:38] Phil: Just plain black.

[00:46:39] Trevor: Does the rose gold fit?

[00:46:40] Phil: Black and silver. Oh, maybe. Yeah, I can look at both.

[00:46:44] Trevor: Yeah. The ScanWatch.

[00:46:45] Phil: Take it past the shop and say, oh geez, they look all right. And then, you know, get an indication of what they like, don’t you?

[00:46:51] Trevor: The ScanWatch 2 comes in black or rose gold. Gold, so, and they’re both 38mm.

[00:46:57] Phil: Yeah, one of those would probably get her out of trouble.

[00:46:59] Trevor: It’s— I think, I think she would like it for— it’s, it’s going to do more than what her current thing does. Whatever she’s got now, this will do more. Like, that I’m very confident of. It’s just more app-based. The ScanWatch 2 apparently does do ECG as well, which is phenomenal. Like, the idea that you can run an ECG on a watch that looks like an analog watch is crazy. It

[00:47:22] Phil: is crazy, isn’t it? Exactly right. Exactly right.

[00:47:25] Trevor: So I think they’re your best options. But at the same time, mate, if you’re going to— if you’re going to go down this path, it’s worth the very least maybe just going to Harvey’s or JB’s and just having a look at some of the other ones that, you know, whether it’s the Pixel Watch or one of the Samsungs, because they might not be that much bigger than what you think they are.

[00:47:43] Phil: All right, we’ll do that. No problems at all. Yeah. All right, buddy. Find a place where Withings is. Yeah.

[00:47:48] Trevor: JB’s definitely got withings.

[00:47:50] Phil: Yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah. And like you’re a young fella, I’ve been using a Nothing and I’m very— Nothing phone for myself. And yeah, found that really good.

[00:47:57] Trevor: Mate, get yourself a CMF Nothing watch as well while you’re there, mate. Treat yourself.

[00:48:03] Phil: There you go. Not a problem.

[00:48:05] Trevor: He’s a nurse, mate. He’s a nurse.

[00:48:07] Phil: Exactly. What’s good for the goose.

[00:48:09] Trevor: All right, buddy. Good on you. Thanks for getting in touch.

[00:48:11] Phil: Thanks, Trev. You take care, mate.

[00:48:12] Trevor: Cheers, mate. Anytime. Great to hear from you, mate. It’s interesting because there’s a very narrow field of watches that aren’t either big and bulky, thin and aren’t, you know, don’t have displays. But that Withings, I keep forgetting, great, great device.

[00:48:30] VOICE OVER: Helping Australians with tech questions for over 15 years, the EFTN podcast with Trevor Long.

Chris Edwards (Vision Australia) — Smart glasses for blind and low vision Australians

[00:48:39] Trevor: Great to have your company and appreciate you downloading downloading and listening and getting in touch if you’ve got a tech question. 0477 657 657, or download the EFTM app and click Ask Trev. The COVID of the EFTM Best magazine this year features smart glasses. I’ve spent— like, I don’t think about the magazine until probably August, and then I start panicking about it in September, and I start writing in October, and we get it done. But There’s a lot of topics in there and some interesting stories this year, and self-driving cars, AI, different things, but foldable phones. But the smart glasses debate is one that I’ve grappled with quite extensively across the year because I’ve been using Meta smart glasses for years. What have they been out for, 5 years now? Um, and it’s really only because Meta chose to partner with Kylie Jenner that they got an extreme level of publicity, and it started making people question what they were and how they worked. And then Kmart started selling a similar product, uh, and the headline creep glasses came out. I’ve now got a set from Kogan, I’ve now got a set from HTC, uh, I’ve got the Rockids, I’ve got more smart glasses by different brands than I do smartphones in some, some days. And I get the debate, I do. And I was on Triple M in Melbourne and Mick Malloy called me a creep for admitting that I like the glasses and used them. I was offended, but I move on because I know there’s more to them than that. And I got a fascinating email from Vision Australia this week suggesting that we talk about other uses for the Meta Smart Glasses. And so Vision Australia’s Chief Mission Officer Chris Edwards joins me online. G’day Chris, how you doing?

[00:50:19] Chris Edwards: G’day, true, how are you?

[00:50:21] Trevor: I’m really good. And I want to preface this conversation by saying I think I know what we’re going to talk about because I had a caller 2 years ago, 2 and a half years ago. I looked at my records, March 2024. Justin was his name, lived up in Queensland, and he was visually impaired. And he was asking me what it could do and different things like that. And I was like, oh mate, we’ve got to get you some. And I bought him a set and sent them to him, and he came back on the show and talked about what he could do and Like, this is a conversation that doesn’t happen out there, but it must be one that you’re experiencing because there is another side to the smart glasses story, isn’t there?

[00:51:00] Chris Edwards: Oh, absolutely. Smart glasses are a game-changing technology for our community. And, you know, I think the last time we had sort of such a significant device that’s available in the public would have been the smartphones.

[00:51:15] Trevor: Wow. And let’s be clear, I’ve worked, I’ve seen Apple demonstrate some of their accessibility features for the visually impaired, and they’re things that I would never have noticed, I would never have understood, I would have thought were cumbersome. But when you think about life through a different, you know, sphere, it’s remarkable what we can do with a smartphone. So why should someone with a visual impairment have restricted access to a product because a bunch of people think that they should be regulated or legislated against?

[00:51:47] Chris Edwards: Yeah, absolutely. It’s a major concern for us. You know, these have become an essential part of a person’s toolkit who’s— when they’re blind and low vision. Yeah. What smart glasses can do for us is, you know, help in the home, whether it’s actually identifying what a can of food is or reading some instructions on the back of a packet, right through to, you know, in the workplace, you know, understanding what’s happening, you know, when someone’s doing a presentation through to, you know, what I use it for a lot is getting out and about in the community and whether that’s reading a sign, reading what the bus is, or even, you know, looking at a menu and asking, you know, what sort of options there are that best suit me.

[00:52:34] Trevor: And I think they’re things that most MED-EL smart glasses users are not doing, obviously, because I’m not looking at a packet of rice and saying, can you give me the, you know, cooking ingredients here, cooking instructions? I’m reaching for my I wear my spectacles, which help me read better and see better. But someone with a visual impairment, a blind or low vision, is that what we say? Sorry, I want to be correct in how I—

[00:52:56] Chris Edwards: Yeah, blind or low vision.

[00:52:58] Trevor: Blind or low vision. And that means someone who, you know, it’s a scale, right? There’s a real scale to this for people. And I think people need to understand that someone could stand in a shop. One of the examples I remember giving to someone was someone with blind or low vision could stand in a shopping center dinner in Westfield, they might be with a partner or a carer, whoever they might be on their own, and they might normally use a cane, they might normally, who knows, they might have a guide dog, whatever. They can say, hey Meta, tell me what I’m looking at. And it says, you’re looking at a retail store called JB Hi-Fi. And you’re like, well, I’m here. That’s remarkable.

[00:53:35] Chris Edwards: Oh, it’s like amazing technology. And I think what you’ve really pointed out is that it doesn’t necessarily do away with some of the existing technology. So I’m blind myself. I use a Seeing Eye dog to get around, but it actually complements, you know, the dog to be able to read something. And what it really does is it reduces

[00:53:56] Chris Edwards: the reliance on other people to provide you information. Yeah, it gives you this next level of independence that you’ve never had before. And I think the key thing about smart glasses is they’re hands-free. Yes, we’ve got apps that can do something something similar on a mobile phone. But what happens is that, you know, when you’re blind, you’ve either got a cane in one hand or a dog in the other, generally. And so, you know, when you come up to, you know, a set of stairs or someone hands you a cup of coffee, if you’ve got your phone doing something in one hand and your cane or dog in the other hand, you start running out of hands. And so having, you know, the, the technology which is hands-free and being able to sort of help align what you’re looking at because you know, you can turn your head simply to look at that is

[00:54:51] Chris Edwards: really amazing technology for us. And it’s technology that has been around for some time. But the difference is now it’s affordable. You know, there were specialist products that were like $7,000 a pair.

[00:55:04] Trevor: I was going to say, like OrCam or something like that. I remember testing them and at the time my wife’s grandfather, we were thinking, is this what he could use to read the paper and things like this? And like the concept concept of a piece of technology seeing something and reading it out is not radically new. It’s new in the general scheme of the world, but it’s not radically new. But the power of it being in a set of glasses that also, by the way, let’s acknowledge, look like normal glasses.

[00:55:33] Chris Edwards: Yeah, yeah, I think that’s a really important point. Like,

[00:55:37] Trevor: you’ve already got a stigma of walking around with a seeing-eye dog and a cane. Why add another stigma to your life? Do you know what I mean?

[00:55:47] Chris Edwards: Yeah, you want something that looks cool, whereas some of the specialist glasses, cool wouldn’t have been the description that I would have used.

[00:55:54] Trevor: Oh, don’t worry, I’m testing several glasses and I did buy the Kogan ones because I saw they were advertising, they’re like under $100, and I put them on and I’m like, oh my God, they just look horrible. Why is this happening? Why are we still making things that don’t look good when they’re trying to create a product like this? But leaving that aside, What prompts you to want to have this conversation? Is it that you’re worried that, you know, the wave of public opinion is going to change the availability of this product?

[00:56:22] Chris Edwards: Yeah, certainly. I think that that’s one thing. I think there’s two things. There’s one is, is, you know, this, this increased community attitude to smart glasses. You know, we hear them called pervert glasses and we, you know, we people get accused of, you know, using these glasses for, you know, means that nobody wants in the community. That’s right. And people have done that for years with mobile phones and—

[00:56:51] Trevor: Long lens zoom cameras.

[00:56:52] Chris Edwards: Correct. And so, you know, what we’re saying is that, you know, because these are such an important part of a toolkit for our community, we don’t want people being accused of just because they’re wearing them, you’re blind and you’re a pervert now. You know, what people need to understand is, you know, the only reason why we’re taking a picture with these glasses is so that we can get a verbal interpretation of what’s around us and not rely on other people. And I think that, you know, what we’re keen to do is ensure that government don’t overreact on, you know, some of this, I suppose, social media issue raising and actually, you know, take a measured approach and recognize the importance of these glasses for our community and not require us to have extra steps to be able to prescribe them or all those sorts of things. You know, these are technologies that are life-changing and we recognize that, you know, there’d be some places where you can’t use them. So, you know, in a change room, you know, leisure center or something like that,

[00:58:02] Chris Edwards: of course you haven’t been able to use your mobile phones in that area And neither should you use your smart glasses even if you are blind.

[00:58:09] Trevor: Someone who’s blind or low vision is using them audibly anyway. So, hey, Meta, what am I looking at? Is so much more obvious than someone just holding a smartphone in their pocket and snapping a photo in a change room or wherever it is. So it’s also a silly argument in your— to be cast upon your community.

[00:58:26] Chris Edwards: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And, you know, and these glasses do have those protections of Yeah, they have an LED light that when you are taking a picture or video and, and, you know, I think most people are using these smart glasses to take a picture and load them up onto your social media as quick as possible. You know what, what’s great, you know, the way that people who are blind and low vision use it is, you know, they’re just taking a picture to get a verbal understanding, a text description of what they’re looking at.

[00:58:56] Trevor: And forgive my absolute idiot question here, right? But you mentioned social media, and I, I don’t know what it would be like, and I can’t live that life. But is it also that you should be able to share what you’re seeing on social media if you’ve got family and friends and a shared account and you’re using social media in different ways? Obviously the accessibility allows messages and, and text to be read, and you can, you can have audible interpretation of things on the on the screen of a phone, so an Instagram post. So why shouldn’t someone who’s blind or low vision be able to say, hey Meta, take a photo and share it on my Instagram stories? And that’s their way of saying, this is where I am right now.

[00:59:35] Chris Edwards: Like, same thing with us. Yeah, that’s right. Certainly they can, and that helps. But I think that the important thing is that most people aren’t using it in that way because what they really, what the real benefit for them is, is that to be able to do these amazing interpretations.

[00:59:53] Trevor: Live translation.

[00:59:56] Chris Edwards: Amazing interpretation of, you know, an image. And, you know, you know, I know that, you know, even when I use the smart glasses, the description that I will get from, you know, the, the AI within it is much better than my wife. Not because, yeah, the technology is so good. It’s because, you know, my wife gets tired of actually having to describe things in such detail, whereas a computer doesn’t.

[01:00:23] Trevor: That’s fascinating. Look, I would— what I would say to you in summary on the concern and the legislative approach, I’ve said quite regularly on different shows and in public that if people want to have a genuine conversation about this as an issue, these glasses as an issue, then we need to have a conversation about photography in public. That’s the only conversation we’re having, because there will be a product Chris, in the next year and a half, 2 years, where that you clip onto a shirt and it has a camera and you can just say, hey, bottle, whatever it’s called, you know, tell me what I’m looking at. And that’ll be another version. It just won’t be glasses. So we can’t ban smart glasses because there’ll be another thing. And so what I believe is if this is a true problem, then we need to have a conversation about what is allowed in public, and that is photography, which we’re concerned about. And look, we don’t want to be Dubai with their, their laws, but their law is very simple. You can’t photograph someone in public without their permission, and if you do, it’s an offense. So hey, what’s wrong with that as a law? That’ll stop the creeps with glasses, phones, and Zoom cameras. So we can have a conversation about the concerns of the broader public, but we have to have the conversation about the advantages for people who most people wouldn’t have given consideration to. And I think it’s brilliant that you’re advocating in that sense. A question without notice for you, Chris, and I totally get that you may not have heard of this, but but it just dawned on me that I’m speaking to someone in your role. I was fortunate enough to be asked to judge the James Dyson Awards this year in Australia, and the Australian winner of that was an unbelievable product for the visually impaired. Are you aware of this at all?

[01:01:56] Chris Edwards: No, I’m not.

[01:01:58] Trevor: I want to describe it to you, and then I want to make sure we get you this information and hopefully connect you with the creator of this product. Let’s remember, this is like an invention, so it’s not a real product yet, but And I believe there were 3 judges, if I remember, and I’m pretty sure this was a unanimous winner because I saw it and went, wow. So the cane, that’s the correct terminology, right, for a cane? Yeah. So you’ve got the cane, but now let’s make it smart. So on the handle is a set of sensors, and it’s able to provide tactile feedback. So in your hand, you get vibrative feedback for a forward-facing sensor. So it can see 1 to 5 meters ahead. And give a sensor, you know, alert that there’s something in front, not just the ground that you’re feeling through the cane, but in front of you. And also, I believe there’s a height sensor with vibration feedback to show, you know, that the height might be restricted in front of you, because obviously a cane is really detecting just the low level. And I don’t know, I just thought, this is— yeah, I just thought, wow, that is— whether it can come to market, whether it can be commercialized, whether it can be mainstream, I don’t know, but I thought I thought, wow, what a great idea. I love the idea of someone thinking of this space, a space that the cane obviously hasn’t changed in decades. So yeah, I want to make sure I get you that information because it’s a really, really cool idea.

[01:03:20] Chris Edwards: Great invention. And I think there has been some, some things and I think there is a version of that that we sell at our Vision store at Vision Australia.

[01:03:29] Trevor: Okay.

[01:03:30] Chris Edwards: But yeah, it is a really important important bit of technology because, you know, as you say, like, it’s— there’s one thing identifying where there’s something at ground level, whether it’s a step or an uneven bit of ground. But, you know, one of the most frustrating things for someone who’s blind and low vision is walking along a footpath and hitting your head on a low-hanging branch.

[01:03:51] Trevor: Yes.

[01:03:52] Chris Edwards: You know, where someone hasn’t trimmed their branches.

[01:03:55] Chris Edwards: And, uh, and so, you know, I think that, you know, where you’ve got technology that can help detect that, that’s great. And it’s a great reminder for everybody in the community to, if you’ve got an overhanging branch out the front of your house, chop it off.

[01:04:09] Trevor: Think of other people for once. Well, I’ll get you this information. It was created by a bloke at Swinburne University in Melbourne, I assume that is, and his name’s Tom Poletti. So I’ll make sure I get you this information just so you can check it out as an organization.

[01:04:23] Chris Edwards: That’d be brilliant.

[01:04:24] Trevor: You never know, it could be a great little Aussie invention that takes on the world. And I really appreciate your insights and valuable experience with the Meta Smart Glasses. So Chris, thank you so much for your time.

[01:04:37] Chris Edwards: No worries. Thanks for having me. Terrific.

[01:04:43] VOICE OVER: Be part of the show. Thanks to Vodafone, you can text 0477 657 657.

[01:04:52] Trevor: We’d love to hear from you anytime. Uh, the lines are open 24/7. Just text or WhatsApp us, uh, 0477 646 57657. Please get in touch. Thank you to Vodafone for supporting the text line and ensuring that we can have this really easy, simple communication with you. It’s worked— I think it’s been working wonders. I love it. Such an easy thing to do, and, uh, great to be talking to you each and every week about your tech questions, tech problems, or whatever it might be. I’d love to hear from you about AI. I’d love to hear from you about smart glasses. I’d love to hear from you about whatever you want to talk about. You don’t have to have a problem, you don’t have to have a question, you can just be wanting to have a chinwag about something in the world of tech. I’m here for you, that’s what I do. So get in touch anytime you like here on the EFTM Podcast.

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