The Two Blokes Talking Electric Cars podcast – Episode # 125 – Michael Chose the new GWM Ora5 SUV – but not in pink!

Podcast: Two Blokes Talking Electric Cars

Episode: 125 — Michael Chose the new GWM Ora5 SUV – but not in pink!

Date: 21 June 2026

Hosts: Trevor Long & Stephen Fenech

Guest: Shawn Ticehurst, Head of Automotive Research, NRMA Insurance

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[00:00:00] Trevor Long: This is Two Blokes Talking Electric Cars with Steven Fenech and Trevor Long.

[00:00:06] Stephen Fenech: Thanks to NRMA Insurance and Uniden.

[00:00:10] Trevor Long: And we appreciate their support. NRMA Insurance, helping Australians protect what matters most for 100 years or more, and one of Australia’s largest insurers of electric vehicles. So if you’re in the market for a quote, just give them a call, go online. If your renewal is up, that’s all we ask is that you give them the consideration of your time and see whether you can get a good price. And of course, Uniden Smart Dash Cams. If you have a car, you should have a dash cam, front and rear. As Steven always says, it’s the rear camera that might show what happens because so many accidents are rearward-facing.

[00:00:40] Stephen Fenech: Absolutely, an award-winning camera too in design and function.

[00:00:44] Trevor Long: Great to have your company, Steven. We’re actually gonna talk to NRMA later in the show about the kind of growth in the market and what they’re seeing stats-wise over the last couple of months since, you know, all the drama and the surge.

[00:00:56] Stephen Fenech: People are discovering EVs, or not discovering, they’re sort of getting off the fence. They’re moving more towards, you know, especially what’s happened in the last few weeks and months with the fuel crisis. They’re realizing, hang on, there’s another way to do this.

[00:01:11] Trevor Long: The question will simply be, how does it go from here? ‘Cause you know, with fuel prices back to kind of where they were. I reckon it’s— How does it continue through July and August? That’s gonna be interesting.

[00:01:18] Stephen Fenech: Yeah, I think it’s gonna be, well, a lot of people realizing, oh, you know, people that may not have considered it, they’ll think, oh, let’s give it a try. And they’re thinking, oh, better than they thought.

[00:01:29] Stephen Fenech: And it’s gonna be, yeah, I think you’re gonna see a little bit of a surge.

[00:01:33] Trevor Long: Give ’em a test drive, folks. 0477 123 456. 7657657 is our number. If you wanna send us a text, we’ll get you on the show. We’d love to talk about your thoughts on electric cars, your ownership, your journey, whatever it might be. Wherever you are in the EV world, we’d love to hear from you. Paul’s on the line.

Paul — Long-time Tesla owner on servicing, tyres, and low maintenance

[00:01:49] Stephen Fenech: G’day.

[00:01:50] Paul: Good morning.

[00:01:51] Trevor Long: Mate, where are you at in the world of EVs? Are you an owner or an observer?

[00:01:55] Paul: Yeah, yeah. Long time. We’ve chatted a couple of times before. I’ve got 2 Model S’s. Bought them secondhand about 5 years ago. One’s 9 years old, one’s 10 years old. The best things we’ve ever bought.

[00:02:08] Paul: Still going strong. It’s still charging to 100% what they did when I purchased them.

[00:02:16] Stephen Fenech: Wow.

[00:02:16] Paul: Like 5 years ago. That’s a 70D charges to 325 and the 90D charges to 425.

[00:02:23] Trevor Long: Wow. So the numbers that you’re getting quoted by the car in terms of range are the same essentially as when you, when you first got them and they were secondhand.

[00:02:33] Paul: Yes. No change. When it comes to tires, I’m getting 60,000 to 70,000 Ks out of what I describe as normal tires, not EV tires. And the best thing of the lot, I don’t have Tesla calling me up saying, “Send, bring it in to do maintenance.” They just say, “Hey, listen, we see you got a headlight problem. Can we fix it?” Apart from that, I never hear from them. I hear like the people that, Well, we had a Benz at one stage, but not an electric Benz. And they’d take it in, they’d service it, they’d wash it better than I’ve ever seen a car wash. They’d paint the tyres.

[00:03:14] Stephen Fenech: It’s the world’s most expensive car wash.

[00:03:17] Paul: Yeah. And like—

[00:03:19] Stephen Fenech: I’m a Benz owner, mate, I know the deal.

[00:03:21] Paul: And you know, you go to Kia, you know, we’ll give you free servicing and this. And I just heard from a bloke that’s got a BYD, raves about it, but they want to see it every so often. To service it. And I say, what for? He says, I’d like to know ’cause they charge me so much. And like the insurance we’re paying on it is absolutely ridiculous. We had a couple of claims, so, you know, $4,000 on each, which—

[00:03:47] Stephen Fenech: Wow.

[00:03:48] Paul: You know, it blows it out. But when you look at the car overall, you wouldn’t drive anything else to come for this car.

[00:03:55] Trevor Long: It is a fascinating kind of point about the servicing. And we’ve had this conversation many times. Stephen’s experience of getting a detail receipt that mentioned an oil change is— Yeah. Is by the by, but just in general terms, I don’t know that the legacy car makers have yet shifted their business model. Like I think Tesla essentially makes their money upfront. When they sell a car, Yes. that’s where they make their money. Whereas, you know, the dealership model of decades old was broadly speaking, just get the cars out there and then have people come back and make money through servicing and that kind of stuff. So that model kind of doesn’t exist if you can’t really drag people back and the necessity to come back, it just isn’t there. Cool. And I think that’s exactly ’cause that’s the experience we hear a lot, Steve.

[00:04:38] Stephen Fenech: I’m with you in that. Like I was, I went from a Mercedes to a Tesla and I can remember the Tesla and the, what impressed me about it was I remember they were telling me that there’s only 17, one-seven, moving parts in the car, right? And this was the Model S. And so that to me thought, well, I don’t need this, this won’t need much of a much maintenance. And even I’ve told this story before, I’d just outta habit, booked the car in after 12 months, the Tesla. And I remember them contacting me and saying, “How many Ks you got on the car?” And I said, “Oh, there’s only like 8,000 Ks, if that.” It was like, and they said, “Well, no, you don’t need a service.” They canceled my service. So how often do you hear that? Like Mercedes-Benz, I’m back with them now and I’ve got an EV and I think they’re still trying to hang on to that legacy—

[00:05:29] Trevor Long: Model.

[00:05:29] Stephen Fenech: Past post-sales model to still make money. Yeah.

[00:05:35] Trevor Long: Yeah, I don’t know, Paul. I think that’s— and look, people know my opinions of Tesla generally, but I think it’s fantastic the way they treat the servicing. And I think it’s brilliant the way they respect the fact that people don’t need something done. They won’t force it upon you.

[00:05:52] Paul: Yes. And like when it comes to brakes, like we’ve still got the— well, I certainly haven’t changed the brake pads or the discs.

[00:06:00] Trevor Long: Wow.

[00:06:00] Paul: Because we’re braking and we do so many road miles like we do 1000 K’s each week on each of them.

[00:06:12] Paul: And we don’t use the brakes and we don’t have— we don’t need—

[00:06:18] Trevor Long: I hear you, but it’s one area of a car where they’re— not that I’ve seen— there’s sensors. So you kind of need someone to look, you can take the wheel off and look at the pads to check that they are at a certain grade.

[00:06:30] Stephen Fenech: Right.

[00:06:31] Trevor Long: And while a lot of people drive EVs in a certain way that is regenerative and doesn’t use the braking. I’ve got no doubt that a lot of people aren’t turning on regen as high and they’re using it like a normal car and they are using the brakes. So my, I guess, the way I would side with the car companies in this is at least you want people coming in to have stuff just looked at. Just check it. Just give it a once-over. But it should be a very affordable once-over that says, okay, it’s all good, you’re on track for this and this. And the other thing I’d say to you, Paul, and you mentioned it just in passing, You mentioned tires and you said standard tires, not EV tires. And I gotta tell you, on the Cupra, I’ve just chosen to put, I rang when I went to get new tires. I said, listen, they’re 215/15s, whatever they are. And he goes, that’s a very strange tire. I’ll have to order them in. I said, that’s fine. I didn’t mention that it was an EV, ’cause I went, you know what? I don’t want EV tires again. I actually think that that’s worked against me on tires.

[00:07:27] Stephen Fenech: What’s an EV tire? Low profile? Don’t talk to me about tires.

[00:07:31] Trevor Long: No, it’s not about profile. It’s about the makeup of the tire. Ability to hold the weight.

[00:07:36] Stephen Fenech: Right.

[00:07:36] Trevor Long: But I think that’s a load of BS. I think that an EV-specific tyre is frankly unnecessary, and I’m happy to be challenged on that. But it sounds like, Paul, you— the tyres on yours, but were they on it when you got them secondhand?

[00:07:51] Paul: I think one of them had the original tyres because the guy that owned it had done 38,000 Ks in 5 years. And so Then we just had one blowout because of the suspension error. Needed a wheel alignment. And that’s why, if you have a look at the tires on a lot of cars these days, they only go one direction. So I change my tires so they go both directions. So if I wear on the inside, I can swap it over.

[00:08:21] Trevor Long: You can rotate it. Yeah. Yeah, right.

[00:08:23] Paul: And you know, these are the smarts that you can pick up and it just like the sensors that are on them and things like that. And just putting your hand across the tire and see if it’s wearing flat or not and just use the old matchstick method of checking the tread wear.

[00:08:39] Trevor Long: You know what it probably is, Paul? It’s probably about educating ourselves again and our family. Like I was talking to Jacko who drives the Cooper more than me. I said, mate, okay, so from now on, ’cause we did the tires again and I said, mate, listen, let’s get the advice from the people and I want you to check it every month. And then I want you to be responsible for booking it in to have them rotated and stuff like that. And it’s also just simple maintenance. And I know it’s silly, but the wiper fluid and whatever other, fluids are available. You should just walk around, the checks, as you said, just put your hand on the tires and check things. I think that kind of personal maintenance is just as important as booking it in for a service. So maybe, maybe that’s what we should be advocating for too.

[00:09:16] Stephen Fenech: This is an important conversation too, because this should be part of the thought process too for buying an EV.

[00:09:23] Trevor Long: Yeah.

[00:09:24] Stephen Fenech: I know we’ve said it in the past that it’s all about how new the car is and it’s an EV and all nice and rosy, but that afterthought of, okay, what’s maintenance gonna cost me? What’s involved? You know, if I have an accident, what are repairs gonna be like? They’re really important considerations. And you’ve given us a great example of, well, the longevity, first of all, of the Teslas and the low maintenance that’s required.

[00:09:49] Trevor Long: It was only last week we spoke to someone who just bought a secondhand Tesla.

[00:09:53] Paul: Yeah, and that’s awesome.

[00:09:53] Trevor Long: Very, very happy, Paul. Sounds just like you, Paul. So mate, good on you. Enjoy those. You’re gone.

[00:09:59] Paul: I was just gonna say, 50 years ago, PMG as it was then when it was the phones and the post all in one lot.

[00:10:07] Stephen Fenech: Yeah.

[00:10:08] Paul: They put out a program where they put the responsibility of the vehicle onto the bloke driving it. So it didn’t matter if you were the first bloke or the 10th bloke to drive that vehicle each day, it was your responsibility to check the tyres, check the oil, check the water. They reduced, their maintenance dramatically.

[00:10:28] Paul: And you think about how many people before they get in a car, do they check it? Well, if you’re in a Tesla, you know, it’s going to tell you what your pressures are and things like that.

[00:10:36] Trevor Long: Yeah, exactly.

[00:10:37] Paul: But like, you get in these late model cars, they do it all for you. And if you just follow those things— hey, by the way, the F-150s.

[00:10:45] Trevor Long: Yeah.

[00:10:46] Paul: The Lightning. That company was importing them.

[00:10:49] Trevor Long: And they’ve gone bust. So they’re all— they’re all up for auction, aren’t they?

[00:10:53] Paul: No, they’re coming out and it’s interesting who’s actually selling them. It’s one of the guys that was working for them before.

[00:11:00] Trevor Long: All right. Okay.

[00:11:02] Paul: They still haven’t come out. There’s only, I think, Slattery’s have got 3 coming up.

[00:11:07] Trevor Long: Yeah, look, I think it’s a tough, it’s a tough business model to, you know, ship in a car and convert it to right-hand drive. And I didn’t think it was ever going to work financially unless you’re an absolute enthusiast. But yeah, we’ll keep an eye on it, Paul. Thanks, mate. Thanks for getting back in touch, buddy.

[00:11:20] Stephen Fenech: Good to chat.

[00:11:20] Paul: Have a great day, gentlemen.

[00:11:22] Trevor Long: Thank you. Good on you, mate.

[00:11:23] Paul: Great to hear from you next week.

[00:11:24] Trevor Long: Great to hear from you again, mate. Cheers. Yeah, I mean, look, it’s, as you say, it’s a whole of ownership experience. And there’s also a lot, like think BYD, the Atto 3, it’s been around for a few years now. There’s enough experience there for owners to inform new owners. But Zeekr, Geely, some of the newer brands, there’s not enough experience for people to—

[00:11:45] Stephen Fenech: For many, they’re an unknown quantity, aren’t they? What’s involved. I think that, and they’re very important questions to ask. I think if you are buying a Zeekr, and plenty of people are, and those other brands, that’s an important question to ask. Well, what am I up for servicing, maintenance? If you have an accident, they’re the questions you need to ask when you’re buying.

[00:12:03] Trevor Long: Two blokes talking electric cars. We’d love to hear from you. Tell us about your experience with maintenance, tires, whatever it might be. 0477 657 657. Send us a text. Thanks to Vodafone or a WhatsApp. Doesn’t matter either way. We’ll get you on the show. Always a joy. Always a joy. Get in touch. We’d love to hear from you. Michael’s on the line today.

Michael — Picking up a new GWM Ora 5 SUV, setting up home charging with solar

[00:12:30] Trevor Long: Mate, where are you at? You’re picking up a brand new car, I hear.

[00:12:36] Michael: Yeah, I’m picking up on Friday, hopefully. I ordered a GWM Ora 5, the new electric car which has just recently came. So I think the deliveries are coming this week and next week as well.

[00:12:51] Trevor Long: And so the Ora has been around for a while, but is the Ora 5 the SUV model, like a slightly boosted one?

[00:12:58] Michael: Yeah, that’s the one. It’s a bit bigger than the GWM Ora. Obviously, it’s a bigger range as well. I think it’s 430 kilometres from memory for this one. It’s got a higher DC charging of 120 kilowatts, bigger in size and with bigger— I think it’s refreshed infotainment system with, I think, new software as well.

[00:13:23] Stephen Fenech: Trevor and I have got the GWM page open now. I’m going to ask Trevor a question. What car does that look like? First reaction to what it looks like, what car, other car it looks like?

[00:13:34] Trevor Long: I mean, it looks like a Porsche. Porsche. Exactly what I was supposed to say. There’s no doubt. The rounded headlights certainly have that look about them. But, you know, to me, I remember the original Aura. I was not a fan of the original Aura on paper, if you like, so on the web. But when I started seeing them on the road, I’m like, that’s actually a pretty cool little car. So Michael, take us through the journey.

[00:13:55] Stephen Fenech: How did you settle on a GWM?

[00:13:57] Michael: Yeah, I mean, I’ve been looking at electric cars for, I think, a couple of months, mostly because I’ve just bought a house which actually came with solar panels.

[00:14:10] Stephen Fenech: Nice.

[00:14:12] Michael: I was looking at the Note at least, but I was not sure about it. Then this Middle East crisis happened, and then I would just pull the trigger on that.

[00:14:19] Stephen Fenech: Makes sense.

[00:14:20] Michael: And then I was looking at electric cars. I think initially I test drove Geely EX5. JACU J5 also came, and the MG S5. So I was actually about to pull the plug on Geely. The problem was that I actually, I already own a Chery Leon Tank 300, which is a big petrol SUV, and I wanted to sell it off. So I went to the local Chery dealership and said, how much you can give it me for that? And they asked me, why are you selling it? And I told them I’m looking for an electric vehicle. And then they told me about this Chery Leon 05, which I think recently got launched.

[00:15:02] Trevor Long: Yep, it was at the Melbourne Motor Show. That was its kind of unveiling. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:15:07] Michael: I think it was just a couple of days after that and they showed me the specs and, you know, and then I looked at the specs and I compared it with the basically, uh, Geico J5, uh, itself. Um, and because it’s pretty much the same price, I think they both— this one.

[00:15:24] Trevor Long: Did you get the Ultra? It was $36,990. Wow, that’s decent.

[00:15:28] Michael: Yeah, that’s the one, Ultra.

[00:15:29] Trevor Long: I mean, you got to think about it, that is a brand new car. Yeah, for under $40 grand, fully electric. That’s also got a bit of space, like it’s a decent bit of space inside. You’re happy with the, with, with the size? Obviously there’s only 3 colors for this thing, quite a bright blue, a green, and a cream. What did you— where did you land on that?

[00:15:48] Michael: Oh, I think it’s, uh, from— I think it was like 5 colors, I reckon. I think I got the black.

[00:15:53] Trevor Long: Um, thank God, because on the website I can only see—

[00:15:56] Stephen Fenech: yeah, me too, I can only see 3 as well.

[00:15:57] Trevor Long: Oh, it’s in the Ultra, in the higher version there’s a pink A bright pink and a black.

[00:16:02] Stephen Fenech: Yeah, yeah.

[00:16:04] Trevor Long: Man, that bright pink is pretty wild there. Now, how are you set up at home? You mentioned you’ve got solar. What do you think you’re gonna do charging-wise?

[00:16:14] Michael: I actually have got solar, but I’m kind of looking at maybe just use a granny charger for a while and see how it goes.

[00:16:23] Michael: For a month. And then maybe if I’m— if I’m, you know, if I’m happy with that. Otherwise, if I need more charge, then maybe I’ll put a 7-kilowatt charger.

[00:16:33] Stephen Fenech: And how is that going to suit your driving? Do you do a lot of driving or is it just getting her out and about occasionally? What’s your driving habits like?

[00:16:44] Michael: Mostly work from home, but there’s a couple of days where I have to travel from Canberra to Sydney a lot.

[00:16:50] Stephen Fenech: Okay.

[00:16:50] Michael: So that’s pretty much maybe it required a bit of charging, but I think there’s a lot of fast chargers on the way from Canberra to Sydney. And it’s got decent DC charging, I think 120 kilowatts, so I think that’s good enough for me.

[00:17:06] Trevor Long: Nice, mate, yeah, I’d stop for a coffee in Goulburn or Yass and you’re good to go, no dramas at all.

[00:17:12] Stephen Fenech: Is Yass between Canberra and Sydney?

[00:17:14] Trevor Long: Okay.

[00:17:15] Stephen Fenech: Yeah, Trevor drives that way a lot. I do. Michael, obviously I don’t, but I go north more than south.

[00:17:21] Trevor Long: But you know, the great thing you’ve got in your favor is you mentioned you work from home affair, bit, whenever you’re at home, that solar and that sun’s up, mate, you’re picking this car up in the middle of winter, but don’t use the first month as a pure example because once you get to September, October, you’re gonna start to get pure free juice for that beast. And that is when you start to really feel the power of the decision you’ve made.

[00:17:45] Michael: Yeah, I think, yeah, you know, that’s with the solar and I’ve also got some cheap electricity rates from Origin as well, so that kind of—

[00:17:53] Stephen Fenech: Have you got an EV plan? Have you got the cheap overnight charging?

[00:17:57] Michael: I actually, unfortunately, or maybe fortunately maybe, I’ve got a basic meter, so it doesn’t—

[00:18:04] Trevor Long: So you can’t even do off-peak.

[00:18:05] Stephen Fenech: Oh, you haven’t got a smart meter, yeah, right.

[00:18:06] Trevor Long: Some people go, that’s the best way to go because then you can’t get lumped with the off-peak and peak. So it’s actually not a bad thing. But the reason, the challenge you’ve got is if you wanna go a little bit up in the world with things like your charger, and if you ever wanna do battery or anything, you gotta get rid of the standard meter. It’s gotta be a smart meter for it all to work. But that’s, look, That’s down the track. That’s a future thing. You’re lucky to have good rates. My Origin for the business here has just gone up ridiculous.

[00:18:34] Trevor Long: But my rates at home, like energy rates, have gone down, except what about this, just as a sidebar, the solar tariff is now down to 3 cents. Like they’re basically saying, “Don’t bother generating any power, we don’t need it.” It’s unbelievable how you’re getting—

[00:18:49] Stephen Fenech: That was never a goal of mine. I just wanted to have as low of a power bill as I could.

[00:18:54] Trevor Long: Yeah, I do want to make money, but to get the best out of it, you’ve got to do everything during the day. And I guess that’s okay if you’re like us, and my wife can do things at home during the day, but it can be a challenge. Well, mate, so you’re picking up the car this week. I’m disappointed you didn’t get the flamingo pink because now that I look at it, I go, that is one outlandish vehicle there, Michael.

[00:19:14] Michael: That would be quite contrasting.

[00:19:17] Stephen Fenech: Be a head turner.

[00:19:19] Trevor Long: Mate, good luck with the car. Keep in touch and let us know how she ends up for you.

[00:19:24] Michael: All right, thanks guys.

[00:19:25] Trevor Long: Good on you, mate. No worries at all. That’s excellent. What a cool, you know, I saw this at the Melbourne Motor Show when they unveiled it and it’s got the look of the Aura. So those kind of circular headlights.

[00:19:35] Stephen Fenech: But didn’t you think, first thing you thought of, hey, I was right, eh?

[00:19:37] Trevor Long: Yeah.

[00:19:38] Stephen Fenech: It’s like a Porsche.

[00:19:39] Trevor Long: It’s got Porsche kind of— Or Macan, yeah, yeah, yeah. It’s pretty—

[00:19:44] Stephen Fenech: It’s got that look. It’s the round headlights, eh, that does it. The rounded headlights.

[00:19:47] Trevor Long: Yes, I think it’s the rounded headlights for sure. And— You’re currently in a GWM, aren’t you?

[00:19:53] Stephen Fenech: I am, I’m in a big Tank 500.

[00:19:55] Trevor Long: Tank 500, man, oof, that’s a beast. That’s like Land Cruiser style. Tell me about it. Wow.

[00:20:01] Stephen Fenech: Yeah, we’ll be talking about it on the next show.

[00:20:03] Trevor Long: All right, bring it on. That’s a plug-in hybrid there, and we’re trying to get through as many cars as we can so we can have the experience, and we’d love to hear from you. After this, we’ll talk how the NRMA are seeing the electric vehicle market progress. I don’t want to get seasick, but you know, that was the vibe I was getting. Rock and roll. If you’re watching on YouTube, I apologize. If you’re listening in the car, nothing at all happened. You don’t know what’s going on, so it’s all good. We do the show thanks to the great people at Uniti Den Dash Cams and NRMA Insurance. And our guest, our next guest is from NRMA Insurance. We’ve spoken to him before, he’s Shawn Ticehurst, the NRMA Insurance’s head of automotive research. And it’s been about 2 years big few months, so we thought we’d touch base and see where the market’s at. Shawn, great to be with you again, mate.

Shawn Ticehurst (NRMA Insurance) — EV market growth, consumer sentiment, and battery myths

[00:20:58] Shawn Ticehurst: Hi Trevor, hi Steven, good to be with you too.

[00:21:01] Trevor Long: Mate, it has been a just rollercoaster few months. We talked a little bit over the last few months about some of the data you guys put out around the, just the growth in inquiries, ’cause it’s an interesting measure. We’ve obviously got sales data now that we’ve come through several months since the fuel crisis began, and there’s no question the fuel crisis is essentially retracted back some sort of normality, but just the very fact that you can monitor insurance inquiries is a fascinating thing because it essentially did correlate to sales.

[00:21:34] Shawn Ticehurst: Yeah, that’s right. And guys, what a change since we last spoke, how much things have driven. You know, one US president has kind of done more to drive global EV sales than any politician before him, ironically.

[00:21:52] Trevor Long: Without trying, yeah. Without any EV policy.

[00:21:56] Shawn Ticehurst: Exactly.

[00:21:57] Trevor Long: It’s been exactly what a lot of people have been asking for in terms of policy decisions. But, you know, it’s huge numbers.

[00:22:05] Shawn Ticehurst: It is. And yeah, it’s good that we can track this about the insurance quotes people are asking for. So they jump online, they’re considering an EV, they go in, they do a quote, and we can track that. And it’s more than doubled since the same period last year. So if we look at January to May, 2026, compare it to same period 2025, it’s more than doubled. And it’s leading us to revise upwards our forecasts for what EV sales penetration will be in Australia this year.

[00:22:37] Stephen Fenech: You mentioned the certain American president doing a few, his actions driving the adoption of EVs. Is it just that though? I know that’s a major factor, but do you think more people are just sort of getting on board and thinking, well, this is better for my hip pocket?

[00:22:53] Shawn Ticehurst: Yeah, absolutely. I think we saw it. We do our Changing Gears report where we measure consumer sentiment towards EVs. We did the last one 2 years ago. People were sitting on the fence that they were, that they wanted to buy an EV because they were hearing it was good for cost of ownership. They liked the sustainability aspect of it. The cars starting to come were cool, but they weren’t quite sure. This has just been that tipping point. And people were just, they were ready to jump into a battery electric vehicle, but just feeling some uncertainty. And I think, you know, we find it with electric vehicle drivers, they’re smart. They look at the whole cost of ownership, not just the upfront cost. And they’re saying, you know what, it’s these high petrol and diesel prices that are now the tipping point where I’m saying, let’s go.

[00:23:49] Trevor Long: And do you look back at the Changing Gears report, for example, and try and look at it through the lens of what’s happening right now and try and identify what might still be the barriers for people? Because we’ve started to break the barrier of price. It’s still expensive to buy an electric car, but that gap between a petrol and electric equivalent has definitely narrowed. But is there obvious barriers other than the overall ownership cost?

[00:24:18] Shawn Ticehurst: There are still barriers. I think range anxiety is still one that a lot of people who haven’t driven an EV are concerned about. Those that have spent time behind EVs realize you don’t need to be that worried about it. People are just uncertain about charging times and how will it fit into my life. The more they hear about people who’ve taken that leap and they start to say, I’ve owned an EV now for a number of months and you know what, all those things I was worried about with range anxiety or charging times, they’re actually not a problem.

[00:24:54] Shawn Ticehurst: I think I’d say the other thing too is, is two other things actually. One’s about the vehicle choice on the market and the other one’s about concern around the battery. On the vehicle choice, there’s now over 100 EV models on the market.

[00:25:12] Shawn Ticehurst: And, you know, used vehicles now are starting to come through as well. So people that buy used cars are starting to see some choice. But there isn’t yet a car to suit every need, new or used. So some people are saying, “Oh, I can’t quite get the car I want in the price range I want.” want. That’ll change quickly. And the second one’s about people’s concern on the battery. People are starting to realize they don’t need to be as concerned as they first thought.

[00:25:38] Trevor Long: It still comes up though, doesn’t it? The myth of the—

[00:25:40] Stephen Fenech: Yeah.

[00:25:40] Trevor Long: I had someone, a good friend’s elderly mother, and we were just at kids’ sport and I was talking about EVs or my car or something and, “Ah yeah, but the fires.” And I went, “Hey, what are you talking about?” What fires? Like, “What are you talking about?” Yeah. I said, “Yeah, okay, if we wanna put scooters and things, there’s some stories, but if you’ve heard a story about a car car, it might have been a car that was in a garage of a house that burnt down, but it didn’t cause the fire. It’s, it’s still a big myth that’s out there, which is probably the next one I think to bust, because the range one is slowly being busted just by better range in cars. But the battery one is just still a strange, basically unfounded myth, really, Shawn.

[00:26:22] Shawn Ticehurst: Absolutely. No, you’re exactly right. And we know So there’s been 14 EV fires in Australia to date. And this is out of, what are we up to now? I think we’re up to 400,000 EVs on Australian roads. It’s tiny. And we work with a great outfit called EV Fire Safe.

[00:26:43] Trevor Long: Is that Emma? I feel like we’ve spoken.

[00:26:45] Shawn Ticehurst: Emma, yeah, Emma Sutcliffe and her team doing great work. And they’re looking into the cause of these fires. So we know what’s happened with those 14 cars. And often it’s things like, you know, the car was in a bushfire zone, the car was in a high-impact accident, the car was an arson attack. There are some we want to investigate a little more, but we’re talking tiny numbers here. So your point’s absolutely right. It’s something that’s become a myth way out of proportion to the reality.

[00:27:17] Stephen Fenech: The findings are quite comprehensive. Were there any surprises for you in this time around?

[00:27:24] Shawn Ticehurst: The thing for us was how quickly this transition has happened.

[00:27:29] Stephen Fenech: Yeah.

[00:27:30] Shawn Ticehurst: That was probably what was most surprising, the growth in people looking at electric vehicle insurance quotes and just seeing that how quickly that happened. That was probably the most surprising thing. And it, I think it’s just, we’re starting to see 3 factors now nicely coming together. Come into play. There’s the supply, a lot more supply of electric vehicles into the market. There’s government policy around the MVES, the FBT exemption, all of those things. And then there’s now that consumer demand and all three are starting to work quite nicely. But that, that how quick that transition was from March was surprising.

[00:28:14] Trevor Long: One of the things that we’ve talked to you a little bit about is the, the after-sales part of the, of the EV market in terms of servicing and repairs. The other one that’s been fascinating to us that we’ve followed, because we’ve spoken to Brendan Green from Pickles a few times, is— and think about, well, our show, this show’s only been going for a couple of years, and what we’ve experienced in these conversations just in that time, for example, with Brendan, is we go from talking about how, hey, you know, there’s more cars, and now there’s a lot more cars, and then they’ve got battery testing, and now they know about battery health. That’s a really interesting side of the market. And you think about the after-sales or the secondhand process for a buyer, that idea of a battery test is gonna be a game changer for that secondhand market, which is yet to really boom, but it’s certainly having its day.

[00:29:02] Shawn Ticehurst: Absolutely. Yeah, you’re right. The battery testing, I think, has been a game changer. It gives people that confidence they need.

[00:29:12] Shawn Ticehurst: And I fully understand why people are nervous replacing a battery a battery in an EV can cost you anywhere from $20,000 to over $100,000. People don’t want to be up for that cost. People are now starting to realize that these batteries are quite healthy well into their life, and they don’t need to be concerned. So you’re right, that battery testing, um, has been a big change.

[00:29:37] Trevor Long: And I think that, together with the increased consumer interest, you know, general Australians thinking, I’ll buy an EV, has driven up residual values, which is, is And we’ve spoken last week to a guy that bought a secondhand Tesla just earlier on the show, a bloke that owns a couple of older secondhand Teslas, and it’s— there’s just no— there’s no concern in their voice for the battery’s ability or range.

[00:30:02] Stephen Fenech: Just charge into the full place.

[00:30:03] Trevor Long: All it requires essentially is an acceptance that you’ve got an older car with a lower range. A more modern car is going to have more range because they’re building better, more dense batteries with better technology. In them, fine. But the idea that a car battery just stops working is just false. It’s a complete falsity, isn’t it? And that messaging is going to take time, I think, as part of the continued transition to EVs.

[00:30:29] Shawn Ticehurst: That’s right. Yeah, I think we’re all learning that batteries won’t need replacing often, if at all, even on these high-mileage electric vehicles that we’re now starting to see. Remember, EVs are still relatively new. There’s not a lot of old high-mileage EVs out there. We’re starting to see some. So yeah, people are realising, you know, we’re all sort of got that training as humans to be scared of the big bad bear that’s gonna come and attack our cave. And we’re starting to realise this isn’t a big bad bear. It’s not something to be worried about.

[00:31:05] Stephen Fenech: Sean, I’ve got just one last question. He’s on, obviously the insurance space is quite a competitive one and NRMA, no doubt, as you’ve been You mentioned a lot more people insuring their EVs more than ever. Can people now shopping for an EV think that when I do shop for insurance, is my car going to be considered the same as a regular petrol car? Have we reached that point yet where there are enough drivers on the road with EVs to— Because I remember years ago, I’m talking 8, 9 years ago when I got my first EV, it was considered a high-powered vehicle and was sort sort of needed slightly higher insurance, but have we reached a point now where EVs and petrol cars can kind of be considered to be almost the same?

[00:31:49] Shawn Ticehurst: It’s getting much closer. We’re still seeing some of the data slightly different. Repair times, for instance, are still slightly longer than for combustion engine cars, but we know why and we’re working to solve that. So we think that will come down. We research, the research center we have in Sydney, we research the new electric vehicles and we’ve now covered over 95% of the EVs that are available in Australia based on sales volume. So we’re able to really understand what it is about each of those popular EVs and we wanna then be there to insure them and be there for people who want an insurance product for their EV.

[00:32:31] Trevor Long: Yeah, just finally, you mentioned the Changing Gears report, which we covered comprehensively, kind of both parts of it as it’s come out. And you mentioned it’s kind of a couple of years old now. I imagine you had a plan to continue and do that again, but has this, you know, rush of EVs and this current market, does it make you think we should probably touch base and get back into that data and do another round?

[00:32:55] Shawn Ticehurst: Yeah, stay tuned, I guess is what I could say. Look, we have planned one even ahead of all the changes that have taken place over the last couple of months. We’ll have something coming out very shortly. It’s being worked on. Right at the moment. So that was in the plan to do it this year.

[00:33:10] Trevor Long: It’s just gonna be so fascinating to unpack the change in the mood of people around this whole thing.

[00:33:16] Shawn Ticehurst: Absolutely, it will. Yeah, it will be really interesting to see that change.

[00:33:21] Trevor Long: Awesome stuff, mate. Shawn Tysus, Head of Automotive Research for NRMA Insurance. Mate, we always appreciate your time and knowledge, and we look forward to speaking again, no doubt, very soon.

[00:33:31] Stephen Fenech: Thanks, Shawn.

[00:33:31] Shawn Ticehurst: Thanks, Trevor. Thanks, Steven. Good to be with you.

[00:33:33] Trevor Long: Cheers. There you go. It’s just such important data and it doesn’t help to just talk about it. You’ve gotta get the research and the data. And that’s what they’re doing is actually trying to understand the market a little bit.

[00:33:45] Stephen Fenech: They’re proactive in the whole thing. Like we’ve known for a long time they’re trying to get all the repair places to be sort of up to speed with, or when, you know, that’s when you call InsuranceAI when you need help.

[00:33:55] Trevor Long: You think about data, there’s no doubt they know exactly like how many hours and days it takes to repair a car and they wanna bring that gap down. Down because it’s efficiency.

[00:34:03] Stephen Fenech: Absolutely, it’s in their best interest.

[00:34:04] Trevor Long: Two Blokes Talking Electric Cars, we’d love to hear from you. 0477657657. Whatever your part of the electric car journey, we’ll do it all again next week, Steven, here on Two Blokes Talking Electric Cars.

[00:34:14] Stephen Fenech: I’ll be here.

[00:34:14] Trevor Long: Thank you.